---
title: "Hermotimus, or Concerning the Sects · Σκύθης ἢ πρόξενος"
author: "Lucian"
translator: "Kenneth Kilburn"
languages: [grc, en]
shelf: "Classical Greek"
section: 2 of 4
url: https://scriptura.si/works/lucian-hermotimus/2/
cite: "Lucian, tr. Kenneth Kilburn, Hermotimus, or Concerning the Sects · Σκύθης ἢ πρόξενος, section 2. Scriptura (scriptura.si), https://scriptura.si/works/lucian-hermotimus/2/"
---

# Hermotimus, or Concerning the Sects · Σκύθης ἢ πρόξενος

*Lucian, tr. Kenneth Kilburn*

An old Stoic student is shown that a lifetime may not be enough to find the right school of philosophy.

> Greek: ed. Kenneth Kilburn, from the Perseus Digital Library (canonical-greekLit, tlg0062.tlg063, CC BY-SA 4.0).

> English: Kenneth Kilburn, from the Perseus Digital Library (tlg0062.tlg063.perseus-eng3). Notes are not included.

> Rows follow the references the two texts share (chapters and sections), cut where both reach the end of a sentence.

## 2. Sections 25–42

Source: https://scriptura.si/works/lucian-hermotimus/2/ · cite a paragraph as https://scriptura.si/works/lucian-hermotimus/2/#p-N

[¶0] 25. HERMOTIMUS: You see then, Lycinus, that my labour is not in vain or for trifles, if I desire to be myself a citizen of a city so fair and happy.

> Greek: 25. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Ὁρᾷς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ὡς οὐ μάτην οὐδὲ περὶ μικρῶν κάμων πολίτης ἐπιθυμῶν γενέσθαι καὶ αὐτὸς οὕτω καλῆς καὶ εὐδαίμονος πόλεως;

[¶1] LYCINUS: Yes, Hermotimus, and I myself am in love with the same things and there is nothing I would pray for more. If the city had been near at hand and visible to everyone, you can be sure that long since, without a moment’s hesitation, I myself should have entered in and been a citizen this long time, but, since, as you say, you and the poet Hesiod, it has been built at a very great distance, we must look for the path that leads there and the best guide to follow. Don’t you agree that we must do this?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Καὶ γὰρ αὐτός, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε, τῶν αὐτῶν σοι ἐρῶ καὶ οὐκ ἔστιν ὅ τι ἄν μοι πρὸ τούτων εὐξαίμην γενέσθαι. εἰ μὲν οὖν πλησίον ἦν ἡ πόλις καὶ φανερὰ ἰδεῖν ἅπασι, πάλαι ἄν, εὖ ἴσθι, μηδὲν ἐνδοιάσας αὐτὸς ᾔειν ἐς αὐτὴν καὶ ἐπολιτευόμην ἂν ἐκ πολλοῦ, ἐπεὶ δέ, ὡς ὑμεῖς φατε, σύ τε καὶ Ἡσίοδος ὁ ῥαψῳδός, πάνυ πόρρω ἀπῴκισται, ἀνάγκη ζητεῖν ὁδόν τε τὴν ἄγουσαν ἐπ' αὐτὴν καὶ ἡγεμόνα τὸν ἄριστον. ἢ οὐκ οἴει σὺ χρῆναι οὕτω ποιεῖν;

[¶2] HERMOTIMUS: How else could one go there?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Καὶ πῶς ἂν ἄλλως ἔλθοι τις;

[¶3] LYCINUS: Well, as regards making promises and saying that they know, there are plenty of would-be guides. Many are standing ready, each one saying he is a native of that city. But no one and the same road is to be seen. There are many different ones not at all like each other: one seems to lead to the west, another to the east, another to the north, a fourth straight towards the south; one goes through meadows and gardens and shady spots—a well-watered, pleasant road with nothing to block the way or make hard-going; another is rocky and rough, promising much sun and thirst and exhaustion. Nevertheless all these roads are said to lead to the city, although there is but one city, while they have their ends in the opposite parts of the globe.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐκοῦν ὅσον μὲν ἐπὶ τῷ ὑπισχνεῖσθαι καὶ φάσκειν εἰδέναι πολλὴ ἀφθονία τῶν ἡγησομένων. πολλοὶ γὰρ ἕτοιμοι παρεστᾶσιν αὐτόχθονες ἐκεῖθεν ἕκαστος εἶναι λέγοντες. ὁδός γε μὴν οὐ μία καὶ ἡ αὐτὴ φαίνεται ἀλλὰ πολλαὶ καὶ διάφοροι καὶ οὐδὲν ἀλλήλαις ὅμοιαι· ἡ μὲν γὰρ ἐπὶ τὰ ἑσπέρια, ἡ δὲ ἐπὶ τὴν ἕω φέρειν ἔοικεν, ἡ δέ τις ἐπὶ τὰς ἄρκτους, καὶ ἄλλη εὐθὺ τῆς μεσημβρίας, καὶ ἡ μὲν διὰ λειμώνων καὶ φυτῶν καὶ σκιᾶς εὔυδρος καὶ ἡδεῖα οὐδὲν ἀντίτυπον ἢ δύσβατον ἔχουσα, ἡ δὲ πετρώδης καὶ τραχεῖα πολὺν ἥλιον καὶ δίψος καὶ κάματον προφαίνουσα. καὶ ὅμως αὗται πᾶσαι πρὸς τὴν πόλιν ἄγειν λέγονται μίαν οὖσαν ἐς τὰ ἐναντιώτατα τελευτῶσαι.

[¶4] 26. All my difficulty lies here. For, whichever of them I approach, a man who stands at the beginning of each path at the entrance, a very trustworthy person, stretches out his hand, and urges me to go off along his road, and each one of them says that he alone knows the direct route and that the others are astray, since they have neither gone there themselves nor followed others able to lead them. If I go to his neighbour, he makes similar promises about his own road and vilifies the others. The man next to him acts similarly, and so do they all in turn. The number of roads, then, and the differences between them, and especially the way the guides over-strain themselves, each sect praising its own, worries me immoderately and makes me uncertain. I don’t know which way to turn or which one to follow to reach the city.

> Greek: 26. Ἔνθα δή μοι καὶ ἡ πᾶσα ἀπορία ἐστίν. ἐφ' ἣν γὰρ ἂν ἔλθω αὐτῶν, ἀνὴρ κατὰ τὴν ἀρχὴν τῆς ἀτραποῦ ἑκάστης ἐφεστὼς ἐν τῇ εἰσόδῳ μάλα τις ἀξιόπιστος ὀρέγει τε τὴν χεῖρα καὶ προτρέπει κατὰ τὴν αὑτοῦ ἀπιέναι, λέγων ἕκαστος αὐτῶν μόνος τὴν εὐθεῖαν εἰδέναι τοὺς δ’ ἄλλους πλανᾶσθαι μήτε αὐτοὺς ἐληλυθότας μήτε ἄλλοις ἡγήσασθαι δυναμένοις ἀκολουθήσαντας. κἂν ἐπὶ τὸν πλησίον ἀφίκωμαι, κἀκεῖνος τὰ ὅμοια ὑπισχνεῖται περὶ τῆς αὑτοῦ ὁδοῦ καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους κακίζει, καὶ ὁ παρ' αὐτὸν ὁμοίως καὶ ἑξῆς ἅπαντες. τό τε τοίνυν πλῆθος τῶν ὁδῶν καὶ τὸ ἀνόμοιον αὐτῶν οὐ μετρίως ταράττει με καὶ ἀπορεῖν ποιεῖ, καὶ μάλιστα οἱ ἡγεμόνες ὑπερδιατεινόμενοι καὶ τὰ ἑαυτῶν ἕκαστοι ἐπαινοῦντες. οὐ γὰρ οἶδα ἥντινα τραπόμενος ἢ τῷ μᾶλλον αὐτῶν ἀκολουθήσας ἀφικοίμην ἂν πρὸς τὴν πόλιν.

[¶5] 27. HERMOTIMUS: I will free you from your uncertainty. Trust those who have made the journey before, Lycinus, and you cannot go wrong.

> Greek: 27. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Ἀλλ' ἐγώ σε ἀπολύσω τῆς ἀπορίας. τοῖς γὰρ προωδοιπορηκόσιν, ὦ Λυκῖνε, πιστεύσας οὐκ ἂν σφαλείης.

[¶6] LYCINUS: Whom do you mean? Which road did they go? Which of the guides did they follow? The same uncertainty appears to us in another guise shifting from events to persons.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Τίσι λέγεις; τοῖς κατὰ ποίαν ὁδὸν ἐλθοῦσιν; ἢ τίνι τῶν ἡγεμόνων ἀκολουθήσασιν; αὖθις γὰρ ἡμῖν τὸ αὐτὸ ἄπορον ἐν ἄλλῃ μορφῇ ἀναφαίνεται ἀπὸ τῶν πραγμάτων ἐπὶ τοὺς ἄνδρας μετεληλυθός.

[¶7] HERMOTIMUS: What do you mean?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Πῶς τοῦτο φής;

[¶8] LYCINUS: That the man who took Plato’s path and had him for travelling-companion will obviously praise Plato’s route, and so with Epicurus’s and the rest and you with yours. What about it, Hermotimus? Is that not so?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ὅτι ὁ μὲν τὴν Πλάτωνος τραπόμενος καὶ συνοδοιπορήσας μετ' αὐτοῦ ἐκείνην ἐπαινέσεται δῆλον ὅτι, ὁ δὲ τὴν Ἐπικούρου, ἐκείνην, καὶ ἄλλος ἄλλην, σὺ δὲ τὴν ὑμετέραν. ἢ πῶς γάρ, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε; οὐχ οὕτως;

[¶9] HERMOTIMUS: Of course.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Πῶς γὰρ οὔ;

[¶10] LYCINUS: Then you have not freed me from my uncertainty. I am just as much in the dark which of the travellers to trust. For I see that each of them and the guide himself have tried only one way, and he praises that one and says that it alone leads to the city. But I cannot know whether he is speaking the truth. That he has reached some destination and has seen some city or other, I will perhaps grant him. But whether he has seen the one he should have seen (that in which you and I want to live) or whether, when he should have gone to Corinth, he has arrived at Babylon and thinks he has seen Corinth, I still do not know—certainly not everyone who has seen a city has seen Corinth, if Corinth is not the only city. What particularly makes me uncertain is this—my knowing that only one road can possibly be the right one. Only one road is the Corinth road, and the other roads lead anywhere except to Corinth, unless a man is so much out of his wits as to think that both the road to the Hyperboreans and the road to India lead to Corinth.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐ τοίνυν ἀπέλυσάς με τῆς ἀπορίας, ἀλλ’ ἔτι ὁμοίως ἀγνοῶ τῷ μᾶλλον χρὴ πιστεῦσαι τῶν ὁδοιπόρων. ὁρῶ γὰρ ἕκαστον αὐτῶν καὶ αὐτὸν τὸν ἡγεμόνα μιᾶς πεπειραμένον καὶ ἐκείνην ἐπαινοῦντα καὶ λέγοντα ὡς αὕτη μόνη ἄγει ἐπὶ τὴν πόλιν. οὐ μέντοι ἔχω εἰδέναι εἰ ἀληθῆ φησιν. ἀλλ’ ὅτι μὲν ἀφῖκται πρός τι τέλος καὶ εἶδέ τινα πόλιν δώσω αὐτῷ ἴσως, εἰ δὲ ἐκείνην εἶδεν ἣν ἐχρῆν ἐν ᾗ ἐπιθυμοῦμεν ἐγώ τε καὶ σὺ πολιτεύσασθαι, ἢ δέον εἰς Κόρινθον ἐλθεῖν, ὁ δ’ εἰς Βαβυλῶνα ἀφικόμενος οἴεται Κόρινθον ἑωρακέναι, ἄδηλον ἐμοὶ γοῦν ἔτι—οὐ γὰρ πάντως ὁ τινὰ πόλιν ἰδὼν Κόρινθον εἶδεν, εἴ γε οὐ μόνη πόλις ἐστὶν ἡ Κόρινθος. ὃ δὲ δὴ μάλιστα εἰς ἀπορίαν με καθίστησιν, ἐκεῖνό ἐστιν—τὸ εἰδέναι ὅτι πᾶσα ἀνάγκη μίαν εἶναι τὴν ἀληθῆ ὁδόν· καὶ γὰρ ἡ Κόρινθος μία ἐστίν, αἱ δ’ ἄλλαι πανταχόσε μᾶλλον ἢ εἰς Κόρινθον ἄγουσιν, εἰ μή τις οὕτω σφόδρα παραπαίει ὡς οἴεσθαι καὶ τὴν εἰς Ὑπερβορέους καὶ τὴν εἰς Ἰνδοὺς ἄγουσαν εἰς Κόρινθον στέλλειν.

[¶11] HERMOTIMUS: How could that be, Lycinus? Different roads lead to different places.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Καὶ πῶς οἷόν τε, ὦ Λυκῖνε; ἄλλη γὰρ ἀλλαχόσε ἄγει.

[¶12] 28. LYCINUS: Well then, my dear Hermotimus, no little deliberation is needed when we choose roads and guides, and we shall not act according to the saying and go off wherever our feet take us; in that way we shall be going off on the road to Babylon or Bactra instead of the road to Corinth without realising it. It is by no means sound to trust to fortune and hope we shall perhaps take the best road, if we start out on one or the other without enquiry. It is possible for even that to happen, and perhaps at some period of time’s long history it has already happened; but in a matter of such importance I think we ought not to run such a reckless risk or confine hope entirely within narrow bounds, ready as the proverb says to sail the Aegean or Ionian seas on a mat; then we should have no right to accuse fortune, if with her arrows and spears she did not altogether hit the one thing that is true among the many that are not. Even Homer’s archer did not succeed in that—when he should have shot the dove he cut the string; Teucer I think it was. No, there was much more reason to expect one of the many others to be wounded and fall foul of the arrow than that particular one out of them all. The risk is not slight, if in ignorance we rush into one of the by-ways instead of the straight route in the hope that fortune will make a better choice on our behalf—I think you see that. For still to turn round and come back again in safety is no easy matter once a man casts off his mooring lines and surrenders himself to the wind; he must be tossed about on the sea, usually sick and frightened and with a bad head from the swell, whereas he ought in the first place, before he sailed out, to have climbed up to some look-out and seen whether the wind was fair and favourable for those who wanted to sail over to Corinth, and indeed he ought to have selected the very best navigator and a sound ship able to withstand such a heavy sea.

> Greek: 28. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐκοῦν, ὦ καλὲ Ἑρμότιμε, οὐ μικρᾶς δεῖ βουλῆς ἐπὶ τὴν αἵρεσιν τῶν ὁδῶν τε καὶ ἡγεμόνων, οὐδὲ τοῦτο δὴ τὸ τοῦ λόγου ποιήσομεν—ἔνθα ἂν ἡμᾶς οἱ πόδες φέρωσιν, ἐκεῖσε ἄπιμεν· ἐπεὶ λήσομεν οὕτως ἀντὶ τῆς εἰς Κόρινθον ἀγούσης τὴν ἐπὶ Βαβυλῶνος ἢ Βάκτρων ἀπιόντες. οὐδὲ γὰρ οὐδ’ ἐκεῖνο καλῶς ἔχει τῇ τύχῃ ἐπιτρέπειν ὡς τάχα ἂν τὴν ἀρίστην ἑλομένους, εἰ καὶ ἄνευ ἐξετάσεως ὁρμήσαιμεν ἐπὶ μίαν τῶν ὁδῶν ἡντιναοῦν. δυνατὸν μὲν γὰρ καὶ τοῦτο γενέσθαι, καὶ ἴσως ποτὲ ἐγένετο καὶ ἐν τῷ μακρῷ χρόνῳ· ἡμᾶς δέ γε περὶ τῶν οὕτω μεγάλων οὐκ οἶμαι δεῖν παραβόλως ἀναρριπτεῖν οὐδὲ ἐς στενὸν κομιδῇ κατακλείειν τὴν ἐλπίδα ἐπὶ ῥιπός, ὡς ἡ παροιμία φησί, τὸν Αἰγαῖον ἢ τὸν Ἰόνιον διαπλεῦσαι θέλοντας, ὅτε οὐδὲ αἰτιασαίμεθ' ἂν εὐλόγως τὴν τύχην, εἰ τοξεύουσα καὶ ἀκοντίζουσα μὴ πάντως ἔτυχε τἀληθοῦς ἑνὸς ὄντος ἐν μυρίοις τοῖς ψεύδεσιν, ὅπερ οὐδὲ τῷ Ὁμηρικῷ τοξότῃ ὑπῆρξεν, ὃς δέον τὴν πελειάδα κατατοξεῦσαι, ὁ δὲ τὴν μήρινθον ἐνέτεμεν· ὁ Τεῦκρος οἶμαι. ἀλλὰ παρὰ πολὺ ἐκεῖνο εὐλογώτερον τῶν πολλῶν τρωθήσεσθαι καὶ περιπεσεῖσθαι τῷ τοξεύματι ἐλπίζειν ἢ πάντως ἐκεῖνο τὸ ἓν ἐξ ἁπάντων. ὁ δὲ κίνδυνος ὅτι οὐ μικρός, εἰ ἀντὶ τῆς ἐπ' εὐθὺ ἀγούσης ἐς τῶν πεπλανημένων μίαν ἀγνοοῦντες ἐμπέσοιμεν, ἐλπίζοντες ἄμεινον αἱρήσεσθαι τὴν τύχην ὑπὲρ ἡμῶν, εἰκάζειν οἶμαι. οὐδὲ γὰρ ἀναστρέψαι ἔτι καὶ ἀνασωθῆναι ὀπίσω ῥᾴδιον, ἢν ἅπαξ ἐπιδῷ τις αὑτον τῇ πνεούσῃ τὰ ἀπόγεια λυσάμενος, ἀλλὰ ἀνάγκη ἐν τῷ πελάγει διαφέρεσθαι ναυτιῶντα ὡς τὸ πολὺ καὶ δεδιότα καὶ καρηβαροῦντα ὑπὸ τοῦ σάλου, δέον ἐξ ἀρχῆς πρὶν ἐκπλεῦσαι ἀναβάντα ἐπὶ σκοπήν τινα σκέψασθαι εἰ ἐπίφορόν ἐστι καὶ οὔριον τὸ πνεῦμα τοῖς Κόρινθόνδε διαπλεῦσαι ἐθέλουσι, καὶ νὴ Δία κυβερνήτην ἕνα τὸν ἄριστον ἐκλέξασθαι καὶ ναῦν εὐπαγῆ οἵαν διαρκέσαι πρὸς τηλικοῦτον κλύδωνα.

[¶13] 29. HERMOTIMUS: That is the better way, Lycinus, by far. Yet I know that if you made a round tour of them all you would find no others who were better pilots or more experienced navigators than the Stoics; and, if you want to reach Corinth some day, you will follow them, treading the tracks of Chrysippus and Zeno. No other way is possible.

> Greek: 29. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὕτω γε ἄμεινον, ὦ Λυκῖνε, παρὰ πολύ. πλὴν οἶδά γε ὅτι ἅπαντας ἐν κύκλῳ περιελθὼν οὐκ ἄλλους ἂν εὕροις οὔτε ἡγεμόνας ἀμείνους οὔτε κυβερνήτας ἐμπειροτέρους τῶν Στωϊκῶν, καὶ ἢν ἐθελήσῃς γε ἀφικέσθαι ποτὲ εἰς τὴν Κόρινθον, ἐκείνοις ἕψῃ κατὰ τὰ Χρυσίππου καὶ Ζήνωνος ἴχνη προϊών. ἄλλως δὲ ἀδύνατον.

[¶14] LYCINUS: Do you see, Hermotimus, how universal is that assertion you have made? Plato’s fellow-traveller, Epicurus’s follower, and the rest of them, would say the same, every one of them, that I could not go to Corinth without his company. So I must either believe them all alike (which is ridiculous) or disbelieve them all alike. The latter is by far the safest course until we discover the true one.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ὁρᾷς τοῦτο ὡς κοινόν, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε, εἴρηκας; εἶποι γὰρ ἂν αὐτὸ καὶ ὁ τῷ Πλάτωνι ξυνοδοιπορῶν καὶ ὁ Ἐπικούρῳ ἑπόμενος καὶ οἱ ἄλλοι, μὴ ἂν ἐλθεῖν με εἰς τὴν Κόρινθον εἰ μὴ μεθ' ἑαυτοῦ, ἕκαστος. ὥστε ἢ πᾶσι πιστεύειν χρή (ὅπερ γελοιότατον), ἢ ἀπιστεῖν ὁμοίως. μακρῷ γὰρ ἀσφαλέστατον τὸ τοιοῦτον ἄχρι ἂν εὕρωμεν τὸν ἀληθῆ.

[¶15] 30. Come now, suppose that I, just as I am, still ignorant which of them all has the truth, should choose your way, putting my trust in you, a friend, but one who knows only the way of the Stoics and has travelled by this road alone; then suppose one of the gods brought Plato, Pythagoras, Aristotle, and the rest, back to life, and they stood round me and put questions to me, or even, by Zeus, brought me into court and sued me each and every one of them for maltreatment, saying: “My good Lycinus, what was the matter with you? Who persuaded you to give Chrysippus and Zeno preference over us, who are older by far than they? They were born only yesterday, or the day before, and you have given us no chance to speak, and you have put nothing of what we say to the test.” Supposing they said this, how could I answer them? Or will it be enough if I say that I was persuaded by Hermotimus, a friend of mine? Their answer I know would be: “We, Lycinus, do not know this Hermotimus, whoever he is, and he does not know us either. So you had no right to condemn us all and give a judgment in default against us through relying on a man who is acquainted with only one way in philosophy, and even that perhaps not fully. Lawgivers, Lycinus, do not instruct judges to adopt this procedure, or to give one party a hearing and not allow the other to speak on its own behalf what it thinks is to its own advantage. No, they say that both sides must be given an equal hearing, so that by comparing the opposing arguments they may be assisted in discovering the true and the false, and if they do not adopt this procedure the law allows an appeal to another court.”

> Greek: 30. Ἐπεὶ φέρε, εἰ καθάπερ νῦν ἔχω, ἀγνοῶν ἔτι ὅστις ἐξ ἁπάντων ἐστὶν ὁ ἀληθεύων, ἑλοίμην τὰ ὑμέτερα σοὶ πιστεύσας, ἀνδρὶ φίλῳ, ἀτὰρ μόνα γε τὰ τῶν Στωϊκῶν εἰδότι καὶ μίαν ὁδὸν ὁδοιπορήσαντι ταύτην· ἔπειτα θεῶν τις ἀναβιῶναι ποιήσειε Πλάτωνα καὶ Πυθαγόραν καὶ Ἀριστοτέλην καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους, οἱ δὲ περιστάντες ἐρωτῷέν με ἢ καὶ νὴ Δί' ἐς δικαστήριον ἀγαγόντες ὕβρεως ἕκαστος δικάζοιντο λέγοντες, Ὠ βέλτιστε Λυκῖνε, τί παθὼν ἢ τίνι ποτὲ πιστεύσας Χρύσιππον καὶ Ζήνωνα προετίμησας ἡμῶν, πρεσβυτέρων ὄντων παρὰ πολύ, χθὲς καὶ πρῴην γενομένους, μήτε λόγου μεταδοὺς ἡμῖν μήτε πειραθεὶς ὅλως ὧν φαμέν; εἰ ταῦτα λέγοιεν τί ἂν ἀποκριναίμην αὐτοῖς; ἢ ἐξαρκέσει μοι ἂν εἴπω ὅτι Ἑρμοτίμῳ ἐπείσθην φίλῳ ἀνδρί; ἀλλὰ φαῖεν ἄν, οἶδ’ ὅτι, Ἡμεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, οὐκ ἴσμεν τὸν Ἑρμότιμον τοῦτον ὅστις ποτέ ἐστιν οὐδὲ ἐκεῖνος ἡμᾶς. ὥστε οὐκ ἐχρῆν ἁπάντων καταγιγνώσκειν οὐδὲ ἐρήμην ἡμῶν καταδιαιτᾶν ἀνδρὶ πιστεύσαντα μίαν ὁδὸν ἐν φιλοσοφίᾳ καὶ οὐδὲ ταύτην ἴσως ἀκριβῶς κατανοήσαντι. οἱ δέ γε νομοθέται, ὦ Λυκῖνε, οὐχ οὕτω προστάττουσι τοῖς δικασταῖς ποιεῖν οὐδὲ τοῦ ἑτέρου μὲν ἀκούειν, τὸν δὲ ἕτερον οὐκ ἐᾶν λέγειν ὑπὲρ ἑαυτοῦ ἃ οἴεται ξυμφέρειν, ἀλλ’ ὁμοίως ἀμφοῖν ἀκροᾶσθαι, ὡς ῥᾷον ἀντεξετάζοντες τοὺς λόγους εὑρίσκοιεν τἀληθῆ τε καὶ ψευδῆ, καὶ ἤν γε μὴ οὕτω ποιῶσιν ἐφιέναι δίδωσιν ὁ νόμος εἰς ἕτερον δικαστήριον.

[¶16] 31. Such or something like it is the argument they would use. Or one of them perhaps would even put an additional question to me: “Tell me this, Lycinus: suppose an Ethiopian, a man who had never seen other men like us, because he had never been abroad at all, should state and assert in some assembly of the Ethiopians that nowhere in the world were there any men white or yellow or of any other colour than black, would he be believed by them? Or would one of the older Ethiopians say to him: ‘Come now, you are very bold. How do you know this? You have never left us to go anywhere else, and indeed you have never seen what things are like among other peoples?’” I for my part would say that the old man had asked a fair question. Or what do you advise, Hermotimus?
HERMOTIMUS: I agree. His rebuke seems to me very just.

> Greek: 31. Τοιαῦτα ἄττα εἰκὸς ἐρεῖν αὐτούς. ἢ τάχ' ἄν τις αὐτῶν καὶ προσέροιτό με, Εἰπέ μοι, λέγων, ὦ Λυκῖνε, εἴ τις Αἰθίοψ μηδεπώποτε ἄλλους ἀνθρώπους ἰδών, οἷοι ἡμεῖς ἐσμεν, διὰ τὸ μὴ ἀποδεδημηκέναι τὸ παράπαν, ἔν τινι συλλόγῳ τῶν Αἰθιόπων διισχυρίζοιτο καὶ λέγοι μηδαμόθι τῆς γῆς ἀνθρώπους εἶναι λευκοὺς ἢ ξανθοὺς μηδὲ ἄλλο τι ἢ μέλανας, ἆρα πιστεύοιτ' ἂν ὑπ' αὐτῶν; ἢ εἴποι τις ἂν πρὸς αὐτὸν τῶν πρεσβυτέρων Αἰθιόπων, Σὺ δὲ δὴ πόθεν ταῦτα, ὦ θρασύτατε, οἶσθα; οὐ γὰρ ἀπεδήμησας παρ' ἡμῶν οὐδαμόσε οὐδὲ εἶδες νὴ Δία τὰ παρὰ τοῖς ἄλλοις ὁποῖά ἐστι. φαίην ἂν ἔγωγε δίκαια ἐρωτῆσαι τὸν πρεσβύτην. ἢ πῶς ὦ Ἑρμότιμε, συμβουλεύεις;
ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὕτω. δικαιότατα γὰρ ἐπιπλῆξαι δοκεῖ μοι.

[¶17] LYCINUS: To me as well, Hermotimus. But I do not know that you will similarly agree with what follows. To me this too seems to be very just.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Καὶ γὰρ ἔμοιγε, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε. ἀλλὰ τὸ μετὰ τοῦτο οὐκέτ' οἶδα εἰ ὁμοίως καὶ σοὶ δόξει. ἐμοὶ μὲν γὰρ καὶ τοῦτο πάνυ δοκεῖ.

[¶18] HERMOTIMUS: What?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Τὸ ποῖον;

[¶19] 32. LYCINUS: The fellow will certainly go on and say to me something like this: “Let us make a comparison, Lycinus, and posit a man who knows only the Stoic tenets, like this friend of yours, Hermotimus; he has never gone abroad to Plato’s country or stayed with Epicurus or in short with anyone else. Now, if he said that there was nothing in these many lands as beautiful or as true as the tenets and assertions of Stoicism, would you not with good reason think him bold in giving his opinion on all, and that when he knows only one, and has never put one foot outside Ethiopia?” What answer do you think I should give him?

> Greek: 32. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἐπάξει δηλαδὴ ὁ ἀνὴρ καὶ φήσει πρός με ὧδέ πως, Ἀνάλογον τοίνυν, ὦ Λυκῖνε, κείσθω τις ἡμῖν τὰ Στωϊκῶν μόνα εἰδώς, καθάπερ ὁ σὸς φίλος οὗτος ὁ Ἑρμότιμος, ἀποδημήσας δὲ μηδεπώποτε μήτε ἐς Πλάτωνος μήτε παρὰ τὸν Ἐπίκουρον μήτε ὅλως παρ' ἄλλον τινά. εἰ τοίνυν λέγοι μηδὲν οὕτω καλὸν εἶναι μηδ’ ἀληθὲς παρὰ τοῖς πολλοῖς, οἷα τὰ τῆς Στοᾶς ἐστι καὶ ἃ ἐκείνη φησίν, οὐκ ἂν εὐλόγως θρασὺς εἶναι δόξειεν σοι περὶ πάντων ἀποφαινόμενος, καὶ ταῦτα ἓν εἰδώς, οὐδεπώποτε ἐξ Αἰθιοπίας τὸν ἕτερον πόδα προελθών; τί βούλει ἀποκρίνωμαι αὐτῷ;

[¶20] HERMOTIMUS: This very true one, of course: that we do learn Stoicism very thoroughly indeed, since we think fit to pursue this branch of philosophy, but we are not unacquainted with what the others say. For our teacher explains all that to us as he goes along, and knocks it down with his own comments.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Τὸ ἀληθέστατον ἐκεῖνο δηλαδή, ὅτι ἡμεῖς τὰ μὲν Στωϊκῶν καὶ πάνυ ἐκμανθάνομεν ὡς ἂν κατὰ ταῦτα φιλοσοφεῖν ἀξιοῦντες, οὐκ ἀγνοοῦμεν δὲ καὶ τὰ ὑπὸ τῶν ἄλλων λεγόμενα. ὁ γὰρ διδάσκαλος κἀκεῖνα μεταξὺ διέξεισι πρὸς ἡμᾶς καὶ ἀνατρέπει γε αὐτὰ προσθεὶς αὐτός.

[¶21] 33. LYCINUS: Well, do you suppose that at this point the adherents of Plato and Pythagoras and Epicurus and the rest will keep quiet, and not laugh out loud and say to me: “What is your friend Hermotimus doing, Lycinus? He thinks it right to believe what our opponents say about us, and supposes our views to be whatever they say they are, although they either are ignorant of the truth or conceal it. So, if he sees some athlete training before his match, kicking into the air, or punching at empty space as though he were striking his opponent, he will, if he is referee, straightway proclaim him as unbeatable, will he? Or will he consider these romps easy and devoid of risk when he has no antagonist, and adjudge him the winner only when he has overcome and beaten his opponent in the flesh and the latter gives in, and not otherwise? So do not let Hermotimus suppose from the shadow-boxing his teachers practise against us in our absence that they are strong or that our tenets are such as can be easily overthrown. For such a fabrication would be like the houses which children make: they have built them weak in structure and knock them over at once; or again indeed like men practising archery who make bundles of twigs, then fix them up on a pole which they set up at no great distance in front of them, and taking aim let fly. If ever they score a hit and pierce the twigs, they at once give a shout as though they have done something great, because their shaft has gone right through their collection of sticks. But this is not what the Persians do nor the Scythian archers. No, in the first place they themselves are usually on moving horses when they shoot, and secondly, they think that the targets should be moving too, not stationary and waiting for the impact of the shafts, but running about as fast as possible. They generally use wild animals as their targets, and some of them hit birds. If ever they want to test the impact of the shot on the target, they set up a hard-wood board or a raw-hide shield to pierce, and in that way they gain confidence that their arrows can even penetrate armour. So tell Hermotimus from us, Lycinus, that his teachers are setting up collections of sticks to shoot at and then saying that they have bested armed men; and that they are sparring with painted dummies which look like us, and when, as is natural, they have had the better of them they think they have the better of us. To them each of us would quote the words of Achilles about Hector:
‘My helmet’s front they do not see.’”

> Greek: 33. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἢ νομίζεις ἐνταῦθα σιωπήσεσθαι ἡμῖν τοὺς ἀμφὶ τὸν Πλάτωνα καὶ Πυθαγόραν καὶ Ἐπίκουρον καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους, οὐχὶ δὲ ἀναγελάσαντας ἂν εἰπεῖν πρὸς ἐμέ, Οἷα ποιεῖ, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ὁ ἑταῖρός σου ὁ Ἑρμότιμος; ἀξιοῖ τοῖς ἀντιδίκοις περὶ ἡμῶν πιστεύειν καὶ οἴεται τοιαῦτα εἶναι τὰ ἡμέτερα ὁποῖα ἂν ἐκεῖνοι φῶσιν ἢ οὐκ εἰδότες ἢ κρυπτόμενοι τἀληθές; οὐκοῦν ἤν τινα καὶ τῶν ἀθλητῶν ἴδῃ ἀσκούμενον πρὸ τοῦ ἀγῶνος λακτίζοντα εἰς τὸν ἀέρα ἢ πὺξ κενὴν πληγήν τινα καταφέροντα ὡς τὸν ἀνταγωνιστὴν δῆθεν παίοντα, εὐθὺς ἀνακηρύξει αὐτὸν ἀγωνοθέτης ὢν ὡς ἄμαχόν τινα ἢ ἐκεῖνα μὲν οἰήσεται ῥᾴδια εἶναι καὶ ἀσφαλῆ τὰ νεανιεύματα οὐδενὸς ἀνταιρομένου αὐτῷ, τὴν δὲ νίκην τηνικαῦτα κρίνεσθαι ὁπόταν καταγωνίσηται τὸν ἀντίπαλον αὐτὸν καὶ κρατήσῃ ὁ δ’ ἀπαγορεύσῃ, ἄλλως δὲ οὔ; μὴ τοίνυν μηδὲ Ἑρμότιμος ἀφ' ὧν ἂν οἱ διδάσκαλοι αὐτοῦ σκιαμαχῶσι πρὸς ἡμᾶς ἀπόντας οἰέσθω κρατεῖν αὐτοὺς ἢ τὰ ἡμέτερα τοιαῦτα εἶναι ὡς ἀνατρέπεσθαι ῥᾳδίως. ἐπεὶ τὸ τοιοῦτον ὅμοιον ἂν εἴη τοῖς τῶν παιδίων οἰκοδομήμασιν ἃ κατασκευάσαντες ἐκεῖνοι ἀσθενῆ εὐθὺς ἀνατρέπουσιν, ἢ καὶ νὴ Δία τοῖς τοξεύειν μελετῶσιν, οἳ κάρφη τινὰ συνδήσαντες, ἔπειτα ἐπὶ κοντοῦ πήξαντες οὐ πόρρω προθέμενοι στοχάζονται ἀφιέντες, καὶ ἢν τύχωσί ποτε καὶ διαπείρωσι τὰ κάρφη ἀνέκραγον εὐθὺς ὥς τι μέγα ποιήσαντες, εἰ διεξελήλυθεν αὐτοῖς τὸ βέλος διὰ τῶν φρυγάνων. ἀλλ’ οὐ Πέρσαι γε οὕτω ποιοῦσιν οὐδὲ Σκυθῶν ὅσοι τοξόται, ἀλλὰ πρῶτον μὲν αὐτοὶ κινούμενοι ἀφ' ἵππων ὡς τὸ πολὺ τοξεύουσιν, ἔπειτα δὲ καὶ τὰ τοξευόμενα κινεῖσθαι ἀξιοῦσιν οὐχ ἑστῶτα οὐδὲ περιμένοντα τὸ βέλος ἔστ' ἂν ἐμπέσῃ, ἀλλὰ διαδιδράσκοντα ὡς ἔνι μάλιστα. θηρία γέ τοι ὡς τὸ πολὺ κατατοξεύουσι, καὶ ὀρνίθων ἔνιοι τυγχάνουσιν. ἢν δέ ποτε καὶ ἐπὶ σκοποῦ δέῃ πειραθῆναι τοῦ τόνου τῆς πληγῆς, ξύλον ἀντίτυπον ἢ ἀσπίδα ὠμοβοΐνην προθέμενοι διελαύνουσιν, καὶ οὕτως πιστεύουσιν κἂν δι’ ὅπλων σφίσι χωρῆσαι τοὺς οἰστούς. εἰπὲ τοίνυν, ὦ Λυκῖνε, παρ' ἡμῶν Ἑρμοτίμῳ ὅτι οἱ διδάσκαλοι αὐτοῦ φρύγανα προθέμενοι κατατοξεύουσιν, εἶτά φασιν ἀνδρῶν ὡπλισμένων κεκρατηκέναι, καὶ εἰκόνας ἡμῶν γραψάμενοι πυκτεύουσι πρὸς ἐκείνας, καὶ κρατήσαντες ὡς τὸ εἰκός ἡμῶν κρατεῖν οἴονται. ἀλλὰ φαίημεν ἂν ἕκαστος πρὸς αὐτοὺς τὰ τοῦ Ἀχιλλέως ἐκεῖνα, ἅ φησι περὶ τοῦ Ἕκτορος, ὅτι
οὐ γὰρ ἐμῆς κόρυθος λεύσσουσι μέτωπον.

[¶22] 34. This is what they all say, each in his turn, Plato, I fancy, would add one of those stories from Sicily (he knows most of them): Gelo of Syracuse is said to have had bad breath and to have been for a long time ignorant of the fact as no one dared to criticise a tyrant, until a certain foreign woman with whom he had to do dared to tell him how it was. He went to his wife in a rage because she had not told him, although she of all people knew of the bad odour. She begged him to pardon her, for, never having had experience of another man or having been at close quarters with one, she supposed that the mouths of all men had breath like that. “So, Hermotimus,” Plato might say, “since he mixes only with Stoics, naturally does not know what other people’s mouths are like.” Chrysippus could say the same or go even further, if I were to leave him unexamined and go over to Platonism, relying on one of those who had conversed with Plato alone. In short, then, I say that, as long as it is uncertain which creed of philosophy is true, choose none. For choice of one would be misconduct towards the others.

> Greek: 34. ταῦτα μὲν οἱ ξύμπαντες ἐν τῷ μέρει ἕκαστος. Ὁ Πλάτων δ’ ἄν μοι δοκεῖ καὶ διηγήσασθαί τι τῶν ἐκ Σικελίας ὡς ἂν εἰδὼς τὰ πλεῖστα· τῷ γὰρ Συρακουσίῳ Γέλωνί φασι δυσῶδες εἶναι τὸ στόμα καὶ τοῦτο ἐπὶ πολὺ διαλαθεῖν αὐτὸν οὐδενὸς τολμῶντος ἐλέγχειν τύραννον ἄνδρα, μέχρι δή τινα γυναῖκα ξένην συνενεχθεῖσαν αὐτῷ τολμῆσαι καὶ εἰπεῖν ὅπως ἔχοι. τὸν δὲ παρὰ τὴν γυναῖκα ἐλθόντα τὴν ἑαυτοῦ ὀργίζεσθαι ὅτι οὐκ ἐμήνυσε πρὸς αὐτὸν εἰδυῖα μάλιστα τὴν δυσωδίαν, τὴν δὲ παραιτεῖσθαι συγγνώμην ἔχειν αὐτῇ· ὑπὲρ γὰρ τοῦ μὴ πεπειρᾶσθαι ἄλλου ἀνδρὸς μηδὲ ὁμιλῆσαι πλησίον οἰηθῆναι ἅπασι τοῖς ἀνδράσι τοιοῦτό τι ἀποπνεῖν τοῦ στόματος. καὶ ὁ Ἑρμότιμος τοιγαροῦν ἅτε μόνοις τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς ξυνών, φαίη ἂν ὁ Πλάτων, εἰκότως ἀγνοεῖ ὁποῖα τῶν ἄλλων τὰ στόματά ἐστιν. ὅμοια δ’ ἂν καὶ Χρύσιππος εἴποι ἢ ἔτι πλείω τούτων, εἴπερ λιπὼν αὐτὸν ἄκριτον ἐπὶ τὰ Πλάτωνος ὁρμήσαιμι πιστεύσας τινὶ τῶν μόνῳ Πλάτωνι ὡμιληκότων. ἑνί τε λόγῳ ξυνελών φημι, ἄχρι ἂν ἄδηλον ᾖ τίς ἀληθής ἐστι προαίρεσις ἐν φιλοσοφίᾳ, μηδεμίαν αἱρεῖσθαι. ὕβρις γὰρ ἐς τὰς ἄλλας τὸ τοιοῦτον.

[¶23] 35. HERMOTIMUS: In Hestia’s name, Lycinus, let us leave Plato and Aristotle and Epicurus and the others undisturbed, for I am no match for them. Let us, you and me, enquire into it by ourselves, whether the pursuit of philosophy is as I say it is. As for Ethiopians and Gelo’s wife, why did you have to call her from Syracuse into the discussion?

> Greek: 35. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Ὦ Λυκῖνε, πρὸς τῆς Ἑστίας, Πλάτωνα μὲν καὶ Ἀριστοτέλην καὶ Ἐπίκουρον καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους ἀτρεμεῖν ἐάσωμεν· οὐ γὰρ κατ' ἐμὲ ἀνταγωνίζεσθαι αὐτοῖς. νὼ δέ, ἐγώ τε καὶ σύ, ἐφ' ἡμῶν αὐτῶν ἐξετάσωμεν, εἰ τοιοῦτόν ἐστι τὸ φιλοσοφίας πρᾶγμα οἷον ἐγώ φημι αὐτὸ εἶναι. Αἰθίοπας δέ γε ἢ τὴν Γέλωνος γυναῖκα τί ἔδει καλεῖν ἐκ Συρακουσῶν ἐπὶ τὸν λόγον;

[¶24] LYCINUS: Why, let them take themselves off, if they seem to you to be superfluous to the discussion. You do the talking now. You look as though you are going to say something wonderful.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἀλλ' ἐκεῖνοι μὲν ἀπίτωσαν ἐκποδών, εἴ σοι δοκοῦσι περιττοὶ εἶναι πρὸς τὸν λόγον. σὺ δὲ λέγε ἤδη. θαυμαστὸν γάρ τι ἐρεῖν ἔοικας.

[¶25] HERMOTIMUS: It seems to me quite possible, Lycinus, by thorough study of the Stoic doctrines alone, to know the truth from them, even if one does not pursue those of the others and make a thorough study of them in detail. Look at it this way: if someone tells you merely that two twos make the number four, will you have to go about questioning all the other mathematicians to see if there may not perhaps be one of them who makes it five or seven? Or would you know at once that this man is speaking the truth?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Δοκεῖ μοι, ὦ Λυκῖνε, καὶ πάνυ δυνατὸν εἶναι μόνα τὰ τῶν Στωϊκῶν ἐκμαθόντα εἰδέναι τἀληθὲς ἀπὸ τούτων, κἂν μὴ τὰ τῶν ἄλλων ἐπεξέλθῃ τις ἐκμανθάνων ἕκαστα. οὑτωσὶ δὲ σκόπει· ἤν τις λέγῃ πρός σέ μόνον τοῦτο ὡς αἱ δύο δυάδες τὸν τέτταρα ἀριθμὸν ἀποτελοῦσιν, ἆρα δεήσει περιιόντα σε πυνθάνεσθαι τῶν ἄλλων ὅσοι ἀριθμητικοὶ μή τις ἄρα εἴη πέντε ἢ ἑπτὰ λέγων αὐτὰς εἶναι; ἢ αὐτίκα εἰδείης ἂν ὅτι ὁ ἀνὴρ ἀληθῆ λέγει;

[¶26] LYCINUS: At once, Hermotimus.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Αὐτίκα, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε.

[¶27] HERMOTIMUS: Why then does it seem to you to be impossible for a man when he meets only Stoics who speak the truth to believe them and have no further need of the others in his knowledge that four could never be five, even if thousands of Platos and Pythagorases say so?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Τί ποτ' οὖν ἀδύνατον εἶναί σοι δοκεῖ, ἐντυγχάνοντά τινα μόνοις τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς λέγουσι τἀληθῆ πείθεσθαί τε αὐτοῖς καὶ μηκέτι δεῖσθαι τῶν ἄλλων εἰδότα ὡς οὐκ ἄν ποτε τὰ τέτταρα πέντε γένοιτο, οὐδ’ ἂν μυρίοι Πλάτωνες ἢ Πυθαγόραι λέγωσιν;

[¶28] 36. LYCINUS: That is not to the point at all, Hermotimus. You are comparing what is admitted to what is in dispute, although they differ enormously. Or what would you say? Have you met anyone who says that by putting together two twos he makes the number seven or eleven?

> Greek: 36. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐδὲν πρὸς ἔπος, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε. τὰ γὰρ ὁμολογούμενα τοῖς ἀμφισβητουμένοις εἰκάζεις, πάμπολυ αὐτῶν διαφέροντα. ἢ τί ἂν φαίης; ἔστιν ᾧτινι ἐντετύχηκας λέγοντι τὰς δύο δυάδας συντεθείσας τὸν ἑπτὰ ἢ ἕνδεκα ἀριθμὸν ἀποτελεῖν;

[¶29] HERMOTIMUS: Not But anyone would be mad who said the answer was not four.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὐκ ἔγωγε. ἢ μαίνοιτ' ἂν ὁ μὴ τέτταρα ξυμβαίνειν λέγων.

[¶30] LYCINUS: Well then, have you ever met (and by the Graces try to be truthful) any Stoic and Epicurean who did not differ about principles and ends?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Τί δὲ, ἐντετύχηκας πώποτε (καὶ πρὸς Χαρίτων πειρῶ ἀληθεύειν) Στωϊκῷ τινι καὶ Ἐπικουρείῳ μὴ διαφερομένοις περὶ ἀρχῆς ἢ τέλους;

[¶31] HERMOTIMUS: In no way.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὐδαμῶς.

[¶32] LYCINUS: Make sure then that you are not somehow cheating me, my good sir, and that though I am your friend. For, while we are enquiring who has the truth in philosophy, you have prematurely seized on the answer and taken it and assigned it to the Stoics, when you say that they are the ones who make twice two equal four, although it is not clear that this is so. For the Epicureans and the Platonists would say that they get this result, while you Stoics call it five or seven. Or do you not think that this is what they are doing when you think that only the beautiful is good, while the Epicureans say it is pleasure? And when you say that all things are corporeal, while Plato thinks that there is an incorporeal element in what exists? No, as I said, you very arrogantly lay hold of the bone of contention as being the undisputed property of the Stoics, and give it to them to possess; and yet, when the others are asserting rival claims and saying that it is theirs, then, I think, there is every need for a judgment. If it becomes quite clear then that it is the privilege of the Stoics alone to think that twice two are four, it is time for the rest to be quiet. But as long as they contest this very claim, we must give a hearing to all alike, or realise that we shall be thought to be giving a biased judgment.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ὅρα τοίνυν μή πώς με παραλογίζῃ, ὦ γενναῖε, καὶ ταῦτα φίλον ὄντα. ζητούντων γὰρ ἡμῶν οἵτινες ἀληθεύουσιν ἐν φιλοσοφίᾳ, σὺ τοῦτο προαρπάσας ἔδωκας φέρων τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς λέγων ὡς οὗτοί εἰσιν οἱ τὰ δὶς δύο τέτταρα τιθέντες, ὅπερ ἄδηλον εἰ οὕτως ἔχει. φαῖεν γὰρ ἂν οἱ Ἐπικούρειοι ἢ Πλατωνικοί σφᾶς μὲν οὕτω ξυντιθέναι, ὑμᾶς δὲ πέντε ἢ ἑπτὰ λέγειν αὐτά. ἢ οὐ δοκοῦσί σοι τοῦτο ποιεῖν ὁπόταν ὑμεῖς μὲν μόνον τὸ καλὸν ἀγαθὸν ἡγῆσθε εἶναι, οἱ Ἐπικούρειοι δὲ τὸ ἡδύ; καὶ ὅταν ὑμεῖς λέγητε σώματα εἶναι ἅπαντα, ὁ Πλάτων δὲ νομίζῃ καὶ ἀσώματόν τι ἐν τοῖς οὖσιν εἶναι; ἀλλ’ ὅπερ ἔφην, πλεονεκτικῶς πάνυ τὸ ἀμφισβητούμενον συλλαβὼν ὡς ἀναμφιλόγως ἴδιον τῶν Στωϊκῶν δίδως αὐτοῖς ἔχειν, καίτοι ἀντιλαμβανομένων τῶν ἄλλων καὶ λεγόντων αὐτῶν τοῦτο εἶναι, ἔνθα δὴ κρίσεως μάλιστα οἶμαι δεῖ. ἂν μὲν οὖν πρόδηλον γένηται τοῦτο ὡς Στωϊκῶν ἐστι μόνων τὰ δὶς δύο τέτταρα ἡγεῖσθαι, ὥρα σιωπᾶν τοῖς ἄλλοις. ἄχρι δ’ ἂν αὐτοῦ τούτου πέρι διαμάχωνται, πάντων ὁμοίως ἀκουστέον ἢ εἰδέναι ὅτι πρὸς χάριν δικάζειν δόξομεν.

[¶33] 37. HERMOTIMUS: It seems to me, Lycinus, that you do not understand what I mean.

> Greek: 37. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὔ μοι δοκεῖς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, ξυνιέναι πῶς βούλομαι εἰπεῖν.

[¶34] LYCINUS: Then you must speak more clearly, if your argument is to be different from what I say.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐκοῦν σαφέστερον χρὴ λέγειν εἰ ἑτεροῖόν τι ἀλλὰ μὴ τοιοῦτον φήσεις.

[¶35] HERMOTIMUS: You will learn at once what I mean. Let us suppose that two persons have entered the Asclepieum or the sanctuary of Dionysus, and that subsequently one of the sacred chalices is missing. It will without doubt be necessary to search both of them to find out which one of the two has the chalice in his clothing.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Εἴσῃ αὐτίκα οἷόν τι λέγω. θῶμεν γάρ τινας δύο ἐσεληλυθέναι ἐς τὸ Ἀσκληπιεῖον ἢ ἐς τοῦ Διονύσου τὸ ἱερόν, εἶτα μέντοι φιάλην τινὰ τῶν ἱερῶν ἀπολωλέναι. δεήσει δή που ἀμφοτέρους ἐρευνηθῆναι αὐτοὺς ὁπότερος ὑπὸ κόλπου ἔχει τὴν φιάλην.

[¶36] LYCINUS: Very true.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Καὶ μάλα.

[¶37] HERMOTIMUS: One of them surely has it.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Ἔχει δὲ πάντως ὁ ἕτερος.

[¶38] LYCINUS: Of course, if it has disappeared.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Πῶς γὰρ οὔ, εἴ γε ἀπόλωλεν;

[¶39] HERMOTIMUS: And if you discover it on the first, you will not strip the other. It will be quite clear that he has not got it.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οὐκοῦν ἂν παρὰ τῷ προτέρῳ εὕρῃς αὐτήν, οὐκέτι τὸν ἕτερον ἀποδύσεις. πρόδηλον γὰρ ὡς οὐκ ἔχει.

[¶40] LYCINUS: Quite clear.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Πρόδηλον γάρ.

[¶41] HERMOTIMUS: And if we were not to find it in the first one’s clothing, the second man surely has it, and there is in this case too no need of a search.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Καὶ εἴ γε μὴ εὕροιμεν ἐν τῷ τοῦ προτέρου κόλπῳ ὁ ἕτερος πάντως ἔχει, καὶ οὐδὲν ἐρεύνης οὐδὲ οὕτως δεῖ.

[¶42] LYCINUS: Yes, he has it.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἔχει γάρ.

[¶43] HERMOTIMUS: So too in our case. Suppose we find the chalice already in the hands of the Stoics, we shall not bother to search the others, since we have what we have been looking for for a long time. Why should we trouble further?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Καὶ ἡμεῖς τοίνυν εἰ εὕροιμεν ἤδη παρὰ τοῖς Στωϊκοῖς τὴν φιάλην, οὐκέτι ἐρευνᾶν τοὺς ἄλλους ἀξιώσομεν ἔχοντες ὃ πάλαι ἐζητοῦμεν. ἢ τίνος γὰρ ἂν ἕνεκα ἔτι κάμνοιμεν;

[¶44] 38. LYCINUS: There is no reason, if you really find it and once having found it you can know that that is what was missing, or if you can with certainty recognise the sacred object. But in this case, my friend, those first of all who go into the temple are not two, so that one of the two must have the loot, but very many; and secondly just what the missing object is is not clear—whether it is a chalice or a cup or a garland. All the priests give different accounts of it and do not agree even about the very stuff it is made of: some say it is of copper, others of silver, others of gold, yet others of tin. So you must strip all the visitors, if you want to find the missing article. For, if you find a golden chalice straightway on the first, you must nevertheless strip the others as well.

> Greek: 38. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐδενός, εἴ γε εὕροιτε καὶ εὑρόντες ἔχοιτε εἰδέναι ὡς ἐκεῖνο ἦν τὸ ἀπολωλός, ἢ ὅλως γνώριμον ὑμῖν εἴη τὸ ἀνάθημα. νῦν δέ, ὦ ἑταῖρε, πρῶτον μὲν οὐ δύο εἰσὶν οἱ παρελθόντες ἐς τὸν νεών, ὡς ἀναγκαῖον εἶναι τὸν ἕτερον αὐτοῖν τὰ φώρια ἔχειν, ἀλλὰ μάλα πολλοί τινες, εἶτα καὶ τὸ ἀπολόμενον αὐτὸ ἄδηλον ὅ τι ποτέ ἐστιν, εἴτε φιάλη τις ἢ σκύφος ἢ στέφανος. ὅσοι γοῦν ἱερεῖς, ἄλλος ἄλλο εἶναι λέγουσιν καὶ οὐδὲ περὶ τῆς ὕλης αὐτῆς ὁμολογοῦσιν, ἀλλ’ οἱ μὲν χαλκοῦ, οἱ δὲ ἀργύρου, οἱ δὲ χρυσοῦ, οἱ δὲ κασσιτέρου εἶναι αὐτὸ φάσκουσιν. ἀνάγκη τοίνυν ἅπαντας ἀποδῦσαι τοὺς εἰσελθόντας, εἰ βούλει εὑρεῖν τὸ ἀπολωλός. καὶ γὰρ ἂν παρὰ τῷ πρώτῳ εὐθὺς εὕρῃς φιάλην χρυσῆν, ἔτι καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους σοι ἀποδυτέον.

[¶45] HERMOTIMUS: Why, Lycinus?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Διὰ τί, ὦ Λυκῖνε;

[¶46] LYCINUS: Because it is not clear that it was a chalice that was missing. And even if this be admitted by everyone, then they do not all agree that the chalice is golden. And if it is well known that a gold cup is missing, and you find a gold cup on the first man, you would not even so refrain from searching the rest—it would not be clear I suppose whether that was the one belonging to the god. Or do you not think that there are many chalices made of gold?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ὅτι ἄδηλον εἰ φιάλη τὸ ἀπολόμενον ἦν. εἰ δὲ καὶ τοῦτο ὑπὸ πάντων ὁμολογηθείη, ἀλλ’ οὔτι γε χρυσῆν ἅπαντές φασιν εἶναι τὴν φιάλην. εἰ δὲ καὶ μάλιστα γνώριμον γένοιτο ὡς φιάλη ἀπόλοιτο χρυσῆ, καὶ σὺ παρὰ τῷ πρώτῳ εὕροις φιάλην χρυσῆν, οὐδὲ οὕτω παύσῃ διερευνώμενος τοὺς ἄλλους· οὐ γὰρ δῆλόν που εἰ αὐτὴ ἦν ἡ τοῦ θεοῦ. ἢ οὐκ οἴει πολλὰς φιάλας εἶναι χρυσᾶς;

[¶47] HERMOTIMUS: Yes, of course.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Ἔγωγε.

[¶48] LYCINUS: You will have to go to everyone in your search, put together all that you find on each, and guess which one is likely to be the property of the god.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Δεήσει δὴ ἐπὶ πάντας ἰέναι ἐρευνῶντα καὶ τὰ παρ' ἑκάστῳ εὑρεθέντα πάντα εἰς μέσον καταθέντα εἰκάζειν ὅ τι ποτὲ αὐτῶν πρέποι ἂν θεῖον κτῆμα οἴεσθαι.

[¶49] 39. For this is where your great difficulty lies: each of those whom you will strip has surely something—one a cup, another a chalice, another a garland, and each of these may be of bronze, gold, or silver. And it is still not clear whether that which each man has is the holy object. So you have every reason to hesitate about whom to accuse of temple-robbery. In this case, even if all had similar objects, even so it would be uncertain who had stolen the property of the god—for these articles may be private property too. The sole reason for our ignorance, I suppose, is that the missing chalice has no inscription (assuming that it is a chalice), since if it had been inscribed with the name of the god or the person who had made the dedication we should have had less difficulty, and when we had found the inscribed chalice we should stop stripping and troubling the others. I think, Hermotimus, that you have often watched athletic contests?
HERMOTIMUS: You think rightly. Many a time, in many places.

> Greek: 39. Καὶ γὰρ αὖ τὸ τὴν πολλὴν ἀπορίαν παρεχόμενον τοῦτό ἐστιν, ὅτι ἕκαστος τῶν ἀποδυθησομένων ἔχει τι πάντως, ὁ μὲν σκύφον, ὁ δὲ φιάλην, ὁ δὲ στέφανον, καὶ ὁ μὲν ἐκ χαλκοῦ, ὁ δὲ ἐκ χρυσοῦ, ὁ δὲ ἀργύρου. εἰ δὲ ὃ ἔχει, τοῦτο ἱερόν ἐστιν, οὐδέπω δῆλον. πᾶσα τοίνυν ἀνάγκη ἀπορεῖν ὅντινα ἱερόσυλον εἴπῃς, ὅπου γε καὶ εἰ πάντες τὰ ὅμοια εἶχον ἄδηλον ἦν καὶ οὕτως ὅστις ὁ τὰ τοῦ θεοῦ ὑφῃρημένος—ἔστι γὰρ καὶ ἰδιωτικὰ ἔχειν. τὸ δ’ αἴτιον τῆς ἀγνοίας ἕν ἐστιν οἶμαι τὸ ἀνεπίγραφον εἶναι τὴν ἀπολομένην φιάλην (θῶμεν γὰρ φιάλην ἀπολωλέναι), ὡς εἴ γε ἐπεγέγραπτο τοῦ θεοῦ τὸ ὄνομα ἢ τοῦ ἀναθέντος ἧττον ἂν ἐκάμνομεν καὶ εὑρόντες τὴν ἐπιγεγραμμένην ἐπεπαύμεθ' ἂν ἀποδύοντες καὶ ἐνοχλοῦντες τοὺς ἄλλους. οἶμαι δέ σε, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε, καὶ ἀγῶνας ἤδη γυμνικοὺς ἑωρακέναι πολλάκις.
ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Καὶ ὀρθῶς οἴει. πολλάκις γὰρ καὶ πολλαχόθι.

[¶50] LYCINUS: Now, have you ever sat near the judges themselves?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἦ οὖν ποτε καὶ παρὰ τοὺς ἀθλοθέτας αὐτοὺς ἐκαθέζου;

[¶51] HERMOTIMUS: Yes, indeed. Recently at Olympia I sat to the left of the National Judges. Euandridas of Elis reserved me a seat among his fellow-citizens, for I wanted to see everything that happened among the judges from near at hand.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Νὴ Δία, ἔναγχος Ὀλυμπίασιν ἐπὶ τὰ λαιὰ τῶν Ἑλλανοδικῶν, Εὐανδρίδου τοῦ Ἠλείου θέαν μοι προκαταλαβόντος ἐν τοῖς ἑαυτοῦ πολίταις· ἐπεθύμουν γὰρ ἐγγύθεν ἅπαντα ὁρᾶν τὰ παρὰ τοῖς Ἑλλανοδίκαις γιγνόμενα.

[¶52] LYCINUS: Well, do you know this too—how they draw lots for the pairs in the wrestling or the pancratium?

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οἶσθα οὖν καὶ τοῦτο, πῶς κληροῦσιν ὅντινα ᾧτινι χρὴ παλαίειν ἢ παγκρατιάζειν;

[¶53] HERMOTIMUS: Yes, I know.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Οἶδα γάρ.

[¶54] LYCINUS: Then, since you have seen it from near at hand, you could give a better account of it than HERMOTIMUS: In former times, when Heracles was judge, bay-leaves...

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐκοῦν ἂν ἄμεινον σὺ εἴποις ὡς ἐγγύθεν ἰδών.

[¶55] 40. LYCINUS: Don’t tell me about former times, Hermotimus, but what you saw from near at hand.

> Greek: 40. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Τὸ μὲν παλαιὸν ἐπὶ Ἡρακλέους ἀγωνοθετοῦντος φύλλα δάφνης...
ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Μή μοι τὰ πάλαι, ὦ Ἑρμότιμε, ἃ δὲ εἶδες ἐγγύθεν, ἐκεῖνα λέγε.

[¶56] HERMOTIMUS: A silver urn dedicated to the god is placed before them. Into this are thrown small lots, the size of beans, with letters on them. Two are marked alpha, two beta, two gamma, and so on in the same way, if there are more competitors, two lots always having the same letter. Each of the competitors comes up, offers a prayer to Zeus, puts his hand into the urn, and picks up one of the lots. After him another does the same. A policeman stands by each one and holds his hand, not letting him read what the letter is which he has drawn. When all now have their own, the chief police officer, I think it is, or one of the National Judges themselves (I don’t remember now) goes round the competitors, who are standing in a circle, and inspects their lots. In this way he matches one who has alpha to the one who has drawn the other alpha for the wrestling or the pancratium. Similarly he matches the two betas, and the others with the same letter in the same way. This is what he does if the contestants are even in number—eight or four or twelve, for instance—but if they are odd—five or seven or nine—he throws in with the rest a lot marked with an odd letter which has no duplicate. Whoever draws this is given a bye and stands out until the rest have competed, for he has no corresponding letter. This is no small boon to the competitor—the opportunity to come fresh against tired opponents.

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Κάλπις ἀργυρᾶ πρόκειται ἱερὰ τοῦ θεοῦ. ἐς ταύτην ἐμβάλλονται κλῆροι μικροί, ὅσον δὴ κυαμιαῖοι τὸ μέγεθος, ἐπιγεγραμμένοι. ἐγγράφεται δὲ ἐς δύο μὲν ἄλφα ἐν ἑκατέρῳ, ἐς δύο δὲ τὸ βῆτα, καὶ ἐς ἄλλους δύο τὸ γάμμα καὶ ἑξῆς κατὰ τὰ αὐτά, ἢν πλείους οἱ ἀθληταὶ ὦσι, δύο ἀεὶ κλῆροι τὸ αὐτὸ γράμμα ἔχοντες. προσελθὼν δὴ τῶν ἀθλητῶν ἕκαστος προσευξάμενος τῷ Διὶ καθεὶς τὴν χεῖρα ἐς τὴν κάλπιν ἀνασπᾷ τῶν κλήρων ἕνα καὶ μετ' ἐκεῖνον ἕτερος, καὶ παρεστὼς μαστιγοφόρος ἑκάστῳ ἀνέχει αὐτοῦ τὴν χεῖρα οὐ παρέχων ἀναγνῶναι ὅ τι τὸ γράμμα ἐστὶν ὃ ἀνέσπακεν. ἁπάντων δὲ ἤδη ἐχόντων ὁ ἀλυτάρχης οἶμαι ἢ τῶν Ἑλλανοδικῶν αὐτῶν εἷς (οὐκέτι γὰρ τοῦτο μέμνημαι) περιιὼν ἐπισκοπεῖ τοὺς κλήρους ἐν κύκλῳ ἑστώτων καὶ οὕτως τὸν μὲν τὸ ἄλφα ἔχοντα τῷ τὸ ἕτερον ἄλφα ἀνεσπακότι παλαίειν ἢ παγκρατιάζειν συνάπτει, τὸν δὲ τὸ βῆτα τῷ τὸ βῆτα ὁμοίως καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους τοὺς ὁμογράμμους κατὰ ταὐτά. οὕτω μὲν, ἢν ἄρτιοι ὦσιν οἱ ἀγωνισταί, οἷον ὀκτὼ ἢ τέτταρες ἢ δώδεκα, ἢν δὲ περιττοί, πέντε ἑπτὰ ἐννέα, γράμμα τι περιττὸν ἑνὶ κλήρῳ ἐγγραφὲν συμβάλλεται αὐτοῖς, ἀντίγραφον ἄλλο οὐκ ἔχον. ὃς δ’ ἂν τοῦτο ἀνασπάσῃ ἐφεδρεύει περιμένων ἔστ' ἂν ἐκεῖνοι ἀγωνίσωνται· οὐ γὰρ ἔχει τὸ ἀντίγραμμα. καὶ ἔστι τοῦτο οὐ μικρά τις εὐτυχία τοῦ ἀθλητοῦ, τὸ μέλλειν ἀκμῆτα τοῖς κεκμηκόσι συμπεσεῖσθαι.

[¶57] 41. LYCINUS: Stop there. This is just what I wanted. Now, suppose they are nine in number and they have all drawn and are holding their lots. You go round (I want to make you a National Judge instead of a spectator) and inspect the letters. I fancy you will not learn in advance who has been given a bye, unless you go to every one of them and pair them.

> Greek: 41. ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἔχ' ἀτρέμας. τούτου γὰρ ἐδεόμην μάλιστα. οὐκοῦν ἐννέα ὄντες ἀνεσπάκασιν ἅπαντες καὶ ἔχουσι τοὺς κλήρους. περιιὼν δὴ (βούλομαι γάρ σε Ἑλλανοδίκην ἀντὶ θεατοῦ ποιῆσαι) ἐπισκοπεῖς τὰ γράμματα, καὶ οὐ πρότερον οἶμαι μάθοις ἂν ὅστις ὁ ἔφεδρός ἐστιν, ἢν μὴ ἐπὶ πάντας ἔλθῃς καὶ συζεύξῃς αὐτούς.

[¶58] HERMOTIMUS: What do you mean by this, Lycinus?

> Greek: ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Πῶς, ὦ Λυκῖνε, τοῦτο φής;

[¶59] LYCINUS: It is impossible immediately to find that letter which gives you the bye, or perhaps you could find the letter, but you will certainly not know if it is that one, for there is no prior declaration of kappa or mu or iota as the letter which chooses the bye. When you find alpha, you look for the competitor who has the other alpha, and, when you find him, you have already paired them. Then again, when you come on beta, you look for the other beta, the counterpart of the one you have found, and so with all of them, until you are left with the competitor who has the only letter that has no counterpart.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Ἀδύνατόν ἐστιν εὐθὺς εὑρεῖν τὸ γράμμα ἐκεῖνο τὸ δηλοῦν τὸν ἔφεδρον, ἢ τὸ μὲν γράμμα ἴσως ἂν εὕροις, οὐ μὴν εἴσῃ γε εἰ ἐκεῖνός ἐστιν· οὐ γὰρ προείρηται ὅτι τὸ Κ ἢ τὸ Μ ἢ τὸ Ι ἐστὶν τὸ χειροτονοῦν τὸν ἔφεδρον. ἀλλ’ ἐπειδὰν τῷ Α ἐντύχῃς, ζητεῖς τὸν τὸ ἕτερον Α ἔχοντα καὶ εὑρὼν ἐκείνους μὲν ἤδη συνέζευξας, ἐντυχὼν δὲ αὖθις τῷ βῆτα τὸ ἕτερον βῆτα ὅπου ἐστὶν ζητεῖς, τὸ ἀντίπαλον τῷ εὑρεθέντι, καὶ ἐπὶ πάντων ὁμοίως, ἄχρι ἂν ἐκεῖνός σοι περιλειφθῇ ὁ τὸ μόνον γράμμα ἔχων τὸ ἀνανταγώνιστον.

[¶60] 42. HERMOTIMUS: What if you come on this one first or second, what will you do?

> Greek: 42. ΕΡΜΟΤΙΜΟΣ: Τί δ’ εἰ ἐκείνῳ πρώτῳ ἢ δευτέρῳ ἐντύχοις, τί ποιήσεις;

[¶61] LYCINUS: It is not what I shall do. You are the National Judge, and I want to know what you will do. Will you say at once that this man is given a bye, or will you have to go round them all, to see whether there is somewhere a corresponding letter? If you did not look at the lots of everyone, you would not discover who had the bye.

> Greek: ΛΥΚΙΝΟΣ: Οὐ μὲν οὖν, ἀλλὰ σὺ ὁ Ἑλλανοδίκης ἐθέλω εἰδέναι ὅ τι καὶ πράξεις, πότερον αὐτίκα ἐρεῖς ὅτι οὗτός ἐστιν ὁ ἔφεδρος, ἢ δεήσει ἐπὶ πάντας ἐν κύκλῳ ἐλθόντα ἰδεῖν εἴ που αὐτῷ γράμμα ὅμοιόν ἐστιν; ὡς εἴ γε μὴ τοὺς πάντων κλήρους ἴδοις οὐκ ἂν μάθοις τὸν ἔφεδρον.