Soc. Really I am greatly indebted to you, Theodorus, for my acquaintance with Theaetetus and with the Stranger, too.
ΣΩ. ἦ πολλὴν χάριν ὀφείλω σοι τῆς Θεαιτήτου γνωρίσεως, ὦ Θεόδωρε, ἅμα καὶ τῆς τοῦ ξένου.
Theo. Presently, Socrates, you will be three times as much indebted, when they have worked out the statesman and the philosopher for you.
ΘΕΟ. τάχα δέ [γε], ὦ Σώκρατες, ὀφειλήσεις ταύτης τριπλασίαν· ἐπειδὰν τόν τε πολιτικὸν ἀπεργάσωνταί σοι καὶ τὸν φιλόσοφον.
Soc. Indeed! My dear Theodorus, can I believe my ears? Were those really the words of the great calculator and geometrician?
ΣΩ. εἶεν· οὕτω τοῦτο, ὦ φίλε Θεόδωρε, φήσομεν ἀκηκοότες εἶναι τοῦ περὶ λογισμοὺς καὶ τὰ γεωμετρικὰ κρατίστου;
Theo. Why, what do you mean, Socrates?
ΘΕΟ. πῶς, ὦ Σώκρατες;
Soc. When you rated sophist, statesman, and philosopher at the same value, though they are farther apart in worth than your mathematical proportion can express.
ΣΩ. τῶν ἀνδρῶν ἕκαστον θέντος τῆς ἴσης ἀξίας, οἳ τῇ τιμῇ πλέον ἀλλήλων ἀφεστᾶσιν ἢ κατὰ τὴν ἀναλογίαν τὴν τῆς ὑμετέρας τέχνης.
Theo. By Ammon, our special divinity, that is a good hit, Socrates; evidently you haven’t forgotten your mathematics, and you are quite right in, finding fault with my bad arithmetic. I will get even with you at some other time; but now, Stranger, I turn to you. Do not grow tired of being kind to us, but go on and tell us about the statesman or the philosopher, whichever you prefer to take first.
ΘΕΟ. εὖ γε νὴ τὸν ἡμέτερον θεόν, ὦ Σώκρατες, τὸν Ἄμμωνα, καὶ δικαίως, καὶ πάνυ μὲν οὖν μνημονικῶς ἐπέπληξάς μοι τὸ περὶ τοὺς λογισμοὺς ἁμάρτημα. καὶ σὲ μὲν ἀντὶ τούτων εἰς αὖθις μέτειμι· σὺ δʼ ἡμῖν, ὦ ξένε, μηδαμῶς ἀποκάμῃς χαριζόμενος, ἀλλʼ ἑξῆς, εἴτε τὸν πολιτικὸν ἄνδρα πρότερον εἴτε τὸν φιλόσοφον προαιρῇ, προελόμενος διέξελθε.
Str. That is the thing to do, Theodorus, since we have once begun, and we must not stop until we have finished with them. But what shall I do about Theaetetus here?
ΞΕ. ταῦτʼ, ὦ Θεόδωρε, ποιητέον· ἐπείπερ ἅπαξ γε ἐγκεχειρήκαμεν, [καὶ] οὐκ ἀποστατέον πρὶν ἂν αὐτῶν πρὸς τὸ τέλος ἔλθωμεν. ἀλλὰ γὰρ περὶ Θεαιτήτου τοῦδε τί χρὴ δρᾶν με;
Theo. In what respect?
ΘΕΟ. τοῦ πέρι;
Str. Shall we give him a rest and take his schoolmate here, the young Socrates, in his place? What is your advice?
ΞΕ. διαναπαύσωμεν αὐτὸν μεταλαβόντες αὐτοῦ τὸν συγγυμναστὴν τόνδε Σωκράτη; ἢ πῶς συμβουλεύεις;
Theo. Make the change as you suggest. They are young, and if they have a chance to rest by turns, they will bear any labor better.
ΘΕΟ. καθάπερ εἶπες, μεταλάμβανε· νέω γὰρ ὄντε ῥᾷον οἴσετον πάντα πόνον ἀναπαυομένω.
Soc. And besides, Stranger, it seems to me that they are both related to me after a fashion;
ΣΩ. καὶ μὴν κινδυνεύετον, ὦ ξένε, ἄμφω ποθὲν ἐμοὶ συγγένειαν ἔχειν τινά.
Soc. one of them anyhow, as you say, looks like me in his cast of countenance, and the other has the same name and appellation, which implies some sort of kinship. Of course we ought always to be eager to get acquainted with our relatives by debating with them. Now I myself had an argument with Theaetetus yesterday and have been listening to his answers just now, but I do not know Socrates in either way and must examine him, too. But let him reply to you now; my turn will come by and by.
ΣΩ. τὸν μέν γε οὖν ὑμεῖς κατὰ τὴν τοῦ προσώπου φύσιν ὅμοιον ἐμοὶ φαίνεσθαί φατε, τοῦ δʼ ἡμῖν ἡ κλῆσις ὁμώνυμος οὖσα καὶ ἡ πρόσρησις παρέχεταί τινα οἰκειότητα. δεῖ δὴ τούς γε συγγενεῖς ἡμᾶς ἀεὶ προθύμως διὰ λόγων ἀναγνωρίζειν. Θεαιτήτῳ μὲν οὖν αὐτός τε συνέμειξα χθὲς διὰ λόγων καὶ νῦν ἀκήκοα ἀποκρινομένου, Σωκράτους δὲ οὐδέτερα· δεῖ δὲ σκέψασθαι καὶ τοῦτον. ἐμοὶ μὲν οὖν εἰς αὖθις, σοὶ δὲ νῦν ἀποκρινέσθω.
Str. Very well; Socrates, do you hear what Socrates says?
ΞΕ. ταῦτʼ ἔσται. ὦ Σώκρατες, ἀκούεις δὴ Σωκράτους;
Str. And do you agree?
ΞΕ. συγχωρεῖς οὖν οἷς λέγει;
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
Str. There seems to be no objection on your part, and I suppose there should be still less on mine. Well, then, after the sophist, I think it is our next duty to seek for the statesman; so please tell me: should we rank him also among those who have a science, or not?
ΞΕ. οὐ τὰ σὰ κωλύειν φαίνεται, δεῖ δὲ ἴσως ἔτι ἧττον τἀμὰ διακωλύειν. ἀλλὰ δὴ μετὰ τὸν σοφιστὴν ἀναγκαῖον, ὡς ἐμοὶ φαίνεται, πολιτικὸν [τὸν ἄνδρα] διαζητεῖν νῷν· καί μοι λέγε πότερον τῶν ἐπιστημόνων τινʼ ἡμῖν καὶ τοῦτον θετέον, ἢ πῶς;
Y. Soc. Yes.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὕτως.
Str. Must the sciences, then, be divided as when we were examining the sophist?
ΞΕ. τὰς ἐπιστήμας ἄρα διαληπτέον, ὥσπερ ἡνίκα τὸν πρότερον ἐσκοποῦμεν;
Y. Soc. Perhaps.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τάχʼ ἄν.
Str. In that case, Socrates, I think the division will not be along the same lines.
ΞΕ. οὐ μὲν δὴ κατὰ ταὐτόν γε, ὦ Σώκρατες, φαίνεταί μοι τμῆμα.
Y. Soc. How will it be?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. Along other lines.
ΞΕ. κατʼ ἄλλο.
Y. Soc. Very likely.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔοικέν γε.
Str. Where, then, shall we find the statesman’s path? For we must find it, separate it from the rest, and imprint upon it the seal of a single class; then we must set the mark of another single class upon all the other paths that lead away from this, and make our soul conceive of all sciences as of two classes.
ΞΕ. τὴν οὖν πολιτικὴν ἀτραπὸν πῇ τις ἀνευρήσει; δεῖ γὰρ αὐτὴν ἀνευρεῖν, καὶ χωρὶς ἀφελόντας ἀπὸ τῶν ἄλλων ἰδέαν αὐτῇ μίαν ἐπισφραγίσασθαι, καὶ ταῖς ἄλλαις ἐκτροπαῖς ἓν ἄλλο εἶδος ἐπισημηναμένους πάσας τὰς ἐπιστήμας ὡς οὔσας δύο εἴδη διανοηθῆναι τὴν ψυχὴν ἡμῶν ποιῆσαι.
Y. Soc. This, Stranger, is now your affair, I think, not mine.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τοῦτʼ ἤδη σὸν οἶμαι τὸ ἔργον, ὦ ξένε, ἀλλʼ οὐκ ἐμὸν γίγνεται.
Str. And yet, Socrates, it must be your affair, too, when we have found the path.
ΞΕ. δεῖ γε μήν, ὦ Σώκρατες, αὐτὸ εἶναι καὶ σόν, ὅταν ἐμφανὲς ἡμῖν γένηται.
Y. Soc. Quite true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. καλῶς εἶπες.
Str. Are not arithmetic and certain other kindred arts pure sciences, without regard to practical application, which merely furnish knowledge?
ΞΕ. ἆρʼ οὖν οὐκ ἀριθμητικὴ μὲν καί τινες ἕτεραι ταύτῃ συγγενεῖς τέχναι ψιλαὶ τῶν πράξεών εἰσι, τὸ δὲ γνῶναι παρέσχοντο μόνον;
Y. Soc. Yes, they are.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔστιν οὕτως.
Str. But the science possessed by the arts relating to carpentering and to handicraft in general is inherent in their application, and with its aid they create objects which did not previously exist.
ΞΕ. αἱ δέ γε περὶ τεκτονικὴν αὖ καὶ σύμπασαν χειρουργίαν ὥσπερ ἐν ταῖς πράξεσιν ἐνοῦσαν σύμφυτον τὴν ἐπιστήμην κέκτηνται, καὶ συναποτελοῦσι τὰ γιγνόμενα ὑπʼ αὐτῶν σώματα πρότερον οὐκ ὄντα.
Y. Soc. To be sure.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. In this way, then, divide all science into two arts, calling the one practical, and the other purely intellectual.
ΞΕ. ταύτῃ τοίνυν συμπάσας ἐπιστήμας διαίρει, τὴν μὲν πρακτικὴν προσειπών, τὴν δὲ μόνον γνωστικήν.
Y. Soc. Let us assume that all science is one and that these are its two forms.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔστω σοι ταῦθʼ ὡς μιᾶς ἐπιστήμης τῆς ὅλης εἴδη δύο.
Str. Shall we then assume that the statesman, king, master, and householder too, for that matter, are all one, to be grouped under one title, or shall we say that there are as many arts as names? But let me rather help you to understand in this way.
ΞΕ. πότερον οὖν τὸν πολιτικὸν καὶ βασιλέα καὶ δεσπότην καὶ ἔτʼ οἰκονόμον θήσομεν ὡς ἓν πάντα ταῦτα προσαγορεύοντες, ἢ τοσαύτας τέχνας αὐτὰς εἶναι φῶμεν ὅσαπερ ὀνόματα ἐρρήθη; μᾶλλον δέ μοι δεῦρο ἕπου.
Y. Soc. In what way?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῇ;
Str. By this example: If anyone, though himself in private station, is able to advise one of the public physicians, must not his art be called by the same name as that of the man whom he advises?
ΞΕ. τῇδε. εἴ τῴ τις τῶν δημοσιευόντων ἰατρῶν ἱκανὸς συμβουλεύειν ἰδιωτεύων αὐτός, ἆρʼ οὐκ ἀναγκαῖον αὐτῷ προσαγορεύεσθαι τοὔνομα τῆς τέχνης ταὐτὸν ὅπερ ᾧ συμβουλεύει;
Str. Well, then, if a man who is himself in private station is wise enough to advise him who is king of a country, shall we not say that he has the science which the ruler himself ought to possess?
ΞΕ. τί δʼ; ὅστις βασιλεύοντι χώρας ἀνδρὶ παραινεῖν δεινὸς ἰδιώτης ὢν αὐτός, ἆρʼ οὐ φήσομεν ἔχειν αὐτὸν τὴν ἐπιστήμην ἣν ἔδει τὸν ἄρχοντα αὐτὸν κεκτῆσθαι;
Y. Soc. We shall.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. φήσομεν.
Str. But certainly the science of a true king is kingly science?
ΞΕ. ἀλλὰ μὴν ἥ γε ἀληθινοῦ βασιλέως βασιλική;
Str. And will not he who possesses this science, whether he happen to be a ruler or a private citizen, rightly be called “kingly,” when considered purely with reference to his art?
ΞΕ. ταύτην δὲ ὁ κεκτημένος οὐκ, ἄντε ἄρχων ἄντε ἰδιώτης ὢν τυγχάνῃ, πάντως κατά γε τὴν τέχνην αὐτὴν βασιλικὸς ὀρθῶς προσρηθήσεται;
Y. Soc. At least he has a right to be.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δίκαιον γοῦν.
Str. And surely the householder and the master of a family are the same.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν οἰκονόμος γε καὶ δεσπότης ταὐτόν.
Y. Soc. Yes, of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. Well, so far as government is concerned, is there any difference between the grandeur of a large house and the majesty of a small state?
ΞΕ. τί δέ; μεγάλης σχῆμα οἰκήσεως ἢ σμικρᾶς αὖ πόλεως ὄγκος μῶν τι πρὸς ἀρχὴν διοίσετον;
Y. Soc. No.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐδέν.
Str. Then as for the point we were just discussing, it is clear that all these are the objects of one science, and whether a man calls this the art of kingship or statesmanship or householding, let us not quarrel with him.
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν, ὃ νυνδὴ διεσκοπούμεθα, φανερὸν ὡς ἐπιστήμη μία περὶ πάντʼ ἐστὶ ταῦτα· ταύτην δὲ εἴτε βασιλικὴν εἴτε πολιτικὴν εἴτε οἰκονομικήν τις ὀνομάζει, μηδὲν αὐτῷ διαφερώμεθα.
Y. Soc. By no means.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί γάρ;
Str. But this is plain, that any king can do little with his hands or his whole body toward holding his position, compared with what he can do with the sagacity and strength of his soul.
ΞΕ. ἀλλὰ μὴν τόδε γε δῆλον, ὡς βασιλεὺς ἅπας χερσὶ καὶ σύμπαντι τῷ σώματι σμίκρʼ ἄττα εἰς τὸ κατέχειν τὴν ἀρχὴν δύναται πρὸς τὴν τῆς ψυχῆς σύνεσιν καὶ ῥώμην.
Y. Soc. Yes, that is plain.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δῆλον.
Str. Shall we say, then, that the king is more akin to the intellectual than to the manual or the practical in general?
ΞΕ. τῆς δὴ γνωστικῆς μᾶλλον ἢ τῆς χειροτεχνικῆς καὶ ὅλως πρακτικῆς βούλει τὸν βασιλέα φῶμεν οἰκειότερον εἶναι;
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. Shall we, therefore, put all these together as one—the political art and the statesman, the royal art and the king?
ΞΕ. τὴν ἄρα πολιτικὴν καὶ πολιτικὸν καὶ βασιλικὴν καὶ βασιλικὸν εἰς ταὐτὸν ὡς ἓν πάντα ταῦτα συνθήσομεν;
Y. Soc. Obviously.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δῆλον.
Str. Then we should be proceeding in due order if we should next divide intellectual science?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν πορευοίμεθʼ ἂν ἑξῆς, εἰ μετὰ ταῦτα τὴν γνωστικὴν διοριζοίμεθα;
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ γε.
Str. Now pay attention to see if we can perceive any natural line of cleavage in it.
ΞΕ. πρόσεχε δὴ τὸν νοῦν ἂν ἄρα ἐν αὐτῇ τινα διαφυὴν κατανοήσωμεν.
Y. Soc. Tell us of what sort it is.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. φράζε ποίαν.
Str. Of this sort. We recognized a sort of art of calculation.
ΞΕ. τοιάνδε. λογιστική πού τις ἡμῖν ἦν τέχνη.
Str. It is, I suppose, most certainly one of the intellectual arts.
ΞΕ. τῶν γνωστικῶν γε οἶμαι παντάπασι τεχνῶν.
Y. Soc. Of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
Str. And shall we grant to the art of calculation, when it has found out the difference between numbers, any further function than that of passing judgement on them when found out?
ΞΕ. γνούσῃ δὴ λογιστικῇ τὴν ἐν τοῖς ἀριθμοῖς διαφορὰν μῶν τι πλέον ἔργον δώσομεν ἢ τὰ γνωσθέντα κρῖναι;
Y. Soc. No, certainly not.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. Every architect, too, is a ruler of workmen, not a workman himself.
ΞΕ. καὶ γὰρ ἀρχιτέκτων γε πᾶς οὐκ αὐτὸς ἐργατικὸς ἀλλʼ ἐργατῶν ἄρχων.
Str. As supplying knowledge, not manual labor.
ΞΕ. παρεχόμενός γέ που γνῶσιν ἀλλʼ οὐ χειρουργίαν.
Y. Soc. True.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὕτως.
Str. So he may fairly be said to participate in intellectual science.
ΞΕ. δικαίως δὴ μετέχειν ἂν λέγοιτο τῆς γνωστικῆς ἐπιστήμης.
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ γε.
Str. But it is his business, I suppose, not to pass judgement and be done with it and go away, as the calculator did, but to give each of the workmen the proper orders, until they have finished their appointed task.
ΞΕ. τούτῳ δέ γε οἶμαι προσήκει κρίναντι μὴ τέλος ἔχειν μηδʼ ἀπηλλάχθαι, καθάπερ ὁ λογιστὴς ἀπήλλακτο, προστάττειν δὲ ἑκάστοις τῶν ἐργατῶν τό γε πρόσφορον ἕως ἂν ἀπεργάσωνται τὸ προσταχθέν.
Y. Soc. You are right.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὀρθῶς.
Str. Then all such sciences, and all those that are in the class with calculating, are alike intellectual sciences, but these two classes differ from one another in the matter of judging and commanding. Am I right?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν γνωστικαὶ μὲν αἵ τε τοιαῦται σύμπασαι καὶ ὁπόσαι συνέπονται τῇ λογιστικῇ, κρίσει δὲ καὶ ἐπιτάξει διαφέρετον ἀλλήλοιν τούτω τὼ γένη;
Y. Soc. I think so.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. φαίνεσθον.
Str. Then if we bisected intellectual science as a whole and called one part the commanding and the other the judging part, might we say we had made fitting division?
ΞΕ. ἆρʼ οὖν συμπάσης τῆς γνωστικῆς εἰ τὸ μὲν ἐπιτακτικὸν μέρος, τὸ δὲ κριτικὸν διαιρούμενοι προσείποιμεν, ἐμμελῶς ἂν φαῖμεν διῃρῆσθαι;
Y. Soc. Yes, in my opinion.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. κατά γε τὴν ἐμὴν δόξαν.
Str. And surely when men are doing anything in common it is pleasant for them to agree.
ΞΕ. ἀλλὰ μὴν τοῖς γε κοινῇ τι πράττουσιν ἀγαπητὸν ὁμονοεῖν.
Y. Soc. Of course it is.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
Str. On this point, then, so long as we ourselves are in agreement, we need not bother about the opinions of others.
ΞΕ. τούτου τοίνυν μέχριπερ ἂν αὐτοὶ κοινωνῶμεν, ἐατέον τά γε τῶν ἄλλων δοξάσματα χαίρειν.
Y. Soc. Of course not.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. Now to which of these two classes is the kingly man to be assigned? Shall we assign him to the art of judging, as a kind of spectator, or rather to the art of commanding, inasmuch as he is a ruler?
ΞΕ. φέρε δή, τούτοιν τοῖν τέχναιν ἡμῖν τὸν βασιλικὸν ἐν ποτέρᾳ θετέον; ἆρʼ ἐν τῇ κριτικῇ, καθάπερ τινὰ θεατήν, ἢ μᾶλλον τῆς ἐπιτακτικῆς ὡς ὄντα αὐτὸν τέχνης θήσομεν, δεσπόζοντά γε;
Y. Soc. Rather to the latter, of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς γὰρ οὐ μᾶλλον;
Str. Then once more we must see whether the art of command falls into two divisions. It seems to me that it does, and I think there is much the same distinction between the kingly class and the class of heralds as between the art of men who sell what they themselves produce and that of retail dealers.
ΞΕ. τὴν ἐπιτακτικὴν δὴ τέχνην πάλιν ἂν εἴη θεατέον εἴ πῃ διέστηκεν. καί μοι δοκεῖ τῇδέ πῃ, καθάπερ ἡ τῶν καπήλων τέχνη τῆς τῶν αὐτοπωλῶν διώρισται τέχνης, καὶ τὸ βασιλικὸν γένος ἔοικεν ἀπὸ τοῦ τῶν κηρύκων γένους ἀφωρίσθαι.
Y. Soc. How so?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς;
Str. Retail dealers receive and sell over again the productions of others, which have generally been sold before.
ΞΕ. πωληθέντα που πρότερον ἔργα ἀλλότρια παραδεχόμενοι δεύτερον πωλοῦσι πάλιν οἱ κάπηλοι.
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
Str. And in like manner heralds receive the purposes of others in the form of orders, and then give the orders a second time to others.
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν καὶ τὸ κηρυκικὸν φῦλον ἐπιταχθέντʼ ἀλλότρια νοήματα παραδεχόμενον αὐτὸ δεύτερον ἐπιτάττει πάλιν ἑτέροις.
Y. Soc. Very true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἀληθέστατα.
Str. Shall we, then, join the art of the king in the same class with the art of the interpreter, the boatswain, the prophet, the herald, and many other kindred arts, all of which involve giving orders? Or, as we just now made a comparison of functions, shall we now by comparison make a name also—since the class of those who issue orders of their own is virtually nameless—and assign kings to the science of giving orders of one’s own, disregarding all the rest and leaving to someone else the task of naming them? For the object of our present quest is the ruler, not his opposite.
ΞΕ. τί οὖν; εἰς ταὐτὸν μείξομεν βασιλικὴν ἑρμηνευτικῇ, κελευστικῇ, μαντικῇ, κηρυκικῇ, καὶ πολλαῖς ἑτέραις τούτων τέχναις συγγενέσιν, αἳ σύμπασαι τό γʼ ἐπιτάττειν ἔχουσιν; ἢ βούλει, καθάπερ ᾐκάζομεν νυνδή, καὶ τοὔνομα παρεικάσωμεν, ἐπειδὴ καὶ σχεδὸν ἀνώνυμον ὂν τυγχάνει τὸ τῶν αὐτεπιτακτῶν γένος, καὶ ταύτῃ ταῦτα διελώμεθα, τὸ μὲν τῶν βασιλέων γένος εἰς τὴν αὐτεπιτακτικὴν θέντες, τοῦ δὲ ἄλλου παντὸς ἀμελήσαντες, ὄνομα ἕτερον αὐτοῖς παραχωρήσαντες θέσθαι τινά; τοῦ γὰρ ἄρχοντος ἕνεκα ἡμῖν ἡ μέθοδος ἦν ἀλλʼ οὐχὶ τοῦ ἐναντίου.
Y. Soc. Quite right.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
Str. Then since a reasonable distinction between this class and the rest has been made, by distinguishing the commands given as one’s own or another’s, shall we again divide this class, if there is in it any further line of section?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν ἐπειδὴ τοῦτο μετρίως ἀφέστηκεν ἀπʼ ἐκείνων, ἀλλοτριότητι διορισθὲν πρὸς οἰκειότητα, τοῦτο αὐτὸ πάλιν αὖ διαιρεῖν ἀναγκαῖον, εἴ τινα τομὴν ἔτι ἔχομεν ὑπείκουσαν ἐν τούτῳ;
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ γε.
Str. I think there is one; please help me in making the section.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν φαινόμεθα ἔχειν· ἀλλʼ ἐπακολουθῶν σύντεμνε.
Y. Soc. On what line?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῇ;
Str. Take the case of all those whom we conceive of as rulers who give commands: shall we not find that they all issue commands for the sake of producing something?
ΞΕ. πάντας ὁπόσους ἂν ἄρχοντας διανοηθῶμεν ἐπιτάξει προσχρωμένους ἆρʼ οὐχ εὑρήσομεν γενέσεώς τινος ἕνεκα προστάττοντας;
Y. Soc. Of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
Str. Furthermore it is not at all difficult to divide all that is produced into two classes.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν τά γε γιγνόμενα πάντα δίχα διαλαβεῖν οὐ παντάπασι χαλεπόν.
Str. Of the whole class, some have life and others have no life.
ΞΕ. τὰ μὲν ἄψυχα αὐτῶν ἐστί που συμπάντων, τὰ δʼ ἔμψυχα.
Str. And on these same lines we may, if we like, make a division of the part of intellectual science which commands.
ΞΕ. τούτοις δέ γε αὐτοῖς τὸ τοῦ γνωστικοῦ μέρος ἐπιτακτικὸν ὄν, εἴπερ βουλόμεθα τέμνειν, τεμοῦμεν.
Y. Soc. In what way?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. κατὰ τί;
Str. By assigning one part of it to the production of lifeless, the other to that of living objects; and in this way the whole will be divided into two parts.
ΞΕ. τὸ μὲν ἐπὶ ταῖς τῶν ἀψύχων γενέσεσιν αὐτοῦ τάττοντες, τὸ δʼ ἐπὶ ⟨ταῖς⟩ τῶν ἐμψύχων· καὶ πᾶν οὕτως ἤδη διαιρήσεται δίχα.
Y. Soc. Certainly.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. παντάπασί γε.
Str. Let us then leave one half and take up the other, and then let us divide that entire half into two parts.
ΞΕ. τὸ μὲν τοίνυν αὐτῶν παραλίπωμεν, τὸ δʼ ἀναλάβωμεν, ἀναλαβόντες δὲ μερισώμεθα εἰς δύο τὸ σύμπαν.
Y. Soc. Which half shall we take up?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. λέγεις δʼ αὐτοῖν ἀναληπτέον εἶναι πότερον;
Str. That which issues commands relating to living objects, assuredly. For certainly the science of the king is not, like that of the architect, one which supervises lifeless objects; it is a nobler science, since it exercises its power among living beings and in relation to them alone.
ΞΕ. πάντως που τὸ περὶ τὰ ζῷα ἐπιτακτικόν. οὐ γὰρ δὴ τό γε τῆς βασιλικῆς ἐπιστήμης ἐστί ποτε τῶν ἀψύχων ἐπιστατοῦν, οἷον ἀρχιτεκτονικόν, ἀλλὰ γενναιότερον, ἐν τοῖς ζῴοις καὶ περὶ αὐτὰ ταῦτα τὴν δύναμιν ἀεὶ κεκτημένον.
Y. Soc. True.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὀρθῶς.
Str. Now you may notice that the breeding and nurture of living beings is sometimes the nurture of a single animal and sometimes the common care of creatures in droves.
ΞΕ. τήν γε μὴν τῶν ζῴων γένεσιν καὶ τροφὴν τὴν μέν τις ἂν ἴδοι μονοτροφίαν οὖσαν, τὴν δὲ κοινὴν τῶν ἐν ταῖς ἀγέλαις θρεμμάτων ἐπιμέλειαν.
Y. Soc. True.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὀρθῶς.
Str. But we shall find that the statesman is not one who tends a single creature, like the driver of a single ox or the groom who tends a horse; he has more resemblance to a man who tends a herd of cattle or a drove of horses.
ΞΕ. ἀλλʼ οὐ μὴν τόν γε πολιτικὸν εὑρήσομεν ἰδιοτρόφον, ὥσπερ βοηλάτην ἤ τινα ἱπποκόμον, ἀλλʼ ἱπποφορβῷ τε καὶ βουφορβῷ μᾶλλον προσεοικότα.
Y. Soc. That seems to be true, now that you mention it.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. φαίνεταί γε δὴ ῥηθὲν νῦν.
Str. Shall we call the art of caring for many living creatures the art of tending a herd or something like community management?
ΞΕ. πότερον οὖν τῆς ζῳοτροφίας τὴν τῶν συμπόλλων κοινὴν τροφὴν ἀγελαιοτροφίαν ἢ κοινοτροφικήν τινα ὀνομάζομεν;
Y. Soc. Whichever we happen to say.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὁπότερον ἂν ἐν τῷ λόγῳ συμβαίνῃ.
Str. Good, Socrates! If you preserve this attitude of indifference to mere names, you will turn out richer in wisdom when you are old. But now we will, as you suggest, not trouble ourselves about the name; but do you see a way in which a man may show that the art of herding is twofold, and may thereby cause that which is now sought among a double number of things to be sought among half as many?
ΞΕ. καλῶς γε, ὦ Σώκρατες· κἂν διαφυλάξῃς τὸ μὴ σπουδάζειν ἐπὶ τοῖς ὀνόμασιν, πλουσιώτερος εἰς τὸ γῆρας ἀναφανήσῃ φρονήσεως. νῦν δὲ τοῦτο μέν, καθάπερ διακελεύῃ, ποιητέον· τὴν δὲ ἀγελαιοτροφικὴν ἆρʼ ἐννοεῖς πῇ τις δίδυμον ἀποφήνας τὸ ζητούμενον ἐν διπλασίοισι τὰ νῦν ἐν τοῖς ἡμίσεσιν εἰς τότε ποιήσει ζητεῖσθαι;
Y. Soc. I am quite willing to try. I think one kind is the care of men, the other that of beasts.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. προθυμήσομαι. καί μοι δοκεῖ τῶν μὲν ἀνθρώπων ἑτέρα τις εἶναι, τῶν δʼ αὖ θηρίων ἄλλη τροφή.
Str. You made the division with perfect willingness and courage. However, let us do our best not to fall again into your error.
ΞΕ. παντάπασί γε προθυμότατα καὶ ἀνδρειότατα διῄρησαι· μὴ μέντοι τοῦτό γε εἰς αὖθις κατὰ δύναμιν πάσχωμεν.
Y. Soc. What error?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. We must not take a single small part, and set it off against many large ones, nor disregard species in making our division. On the contrary, the part must be also a species. It is a very fine thing to separate the object of our search at once from everything else, if the separation can be made correctly, and so, just now, you thought you had the right division and you hurried our discussion along, because you saw that it was leading towards man. But, my friend, it is not safe to whittle off shavings; it is safer to proceed by cutting through the middle, and in that way one is more likely to find classes. This makes all the difference in the conduct of research.
ΞΕ. μὴ σμικρὸν μόριον ἓν πρὸς μεγάλα καὶ πολλὰ ἀφαιρῶμεν, μηδὲ εἴδους χωρίς· ἀλλὰ τὸ μέρος ἅμα εἶδος ἐχέτω. κάλλιστον μὲν γὰρ ἀπὸ τῶν ἄλλων εὐθὺς διαχωρίζειν τὸ ζητούμενον, ἂν ὀρθῶς ἔχῃ, καθάπερ ὀλίγον σὺ πρότερον οἰηθεὶς ἔχειν τὴν διαίρεσιν ἐπέσπευσας τὸν λόγον, ἰδὼν ἐπʼ ἀνθρώπους πορευόμενον· ἀλλὰ γάρ, ὦ φίλε, λεπτουργεῖν οὐκ ἀσφαλές, διὰ μέσων δὲ ἀσφαλέστερον ἰέναι τέμνοντας, καὶ μᾶλλον ἰδέαις ἄν τις προστυγχάνοι. τοῦτο δὲ διαφέρει τὸ πᾶν πρὸς τὰς ζητήσεις.
Y. Soc. What do you mean by that, Stranger?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς, ὦ ξένε, λέγεις τοῦτο;
Str. I must try to speak still more clearly, Socrates, out of regard for your capacity. Just at present it is impossible to make the matter entirely plain, but I will try to lay it before you a little more fully for the sake of clearness.
ΞΕ. πειρατέον ἔτι σαφέστερον φράζειν εὐνοίᾳ τῆς σῆς φύσεως, ὦ Σώκρατες. ἐν τῷ μὲν οὖν παρεστηκότι τὰ νῦν δηλῶσαι μηδὲν ἐνδεῶς ἀδύνατον· ἐπιχειρητέον δέ τι καὶ σμικρῷ πλέον αὐτὸ προαγαγεῖν εἰς τὸ πρόσθεν σαφηνείας ἕνεκα.
Y. Soc. What is it, then, that you say we did wrongly in making our division just now?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ποῖον οὖν δὴ φράζεις διαιρουμένους ἡμᾶς οὐκ ὀρθῶς ἄρτι δρᾶν;
Str. It was very much as if, in undertaking to divide the human race into two parts, one should make the division as most people in this country do; they separate the Hellenic race from all the rest as one, and to all the other races, which are countless in number and have no relation in blood or language to one another, they give the single name “barbarian”; then, because of this single name, they think it is a single species. Or it was as if a man should think he was dividing number into two classes by cutting off a myriad from all the other numbers, with the notion that he was making one separate class, and then should give one name to all the rest, and because of that name should think that this also formed one class distinct from the other. A better division, more truly classified and more equal, would be made by dividing number into odd and even, and the human race into male and female; as for the Lydians and Phrygians and various others they could be opposed to the rest and split off from them when it was impossible to find and separate two parts, each of which formed a class.
ΞΕ. τοιόνδε, οἷον εἴ τις τἀνθρώπινον ἐπιχειρήσας δίχα διελέσθαι γένος διαιροῖ καθάπερ οἱ πολλοὶ τῶν ἐνθάδε διανέμουσι, τὸ μὲν Ἑλληνικὸν ὡς ἓν ἀπὸ πάντων ἀφαιροῦντες χωρίς, σύμπασι δὲ τοῖς ἄλλοις γένεσιν, ἀπείροις οὖσι καὶ ἀμείκτοις καὶ ἀσυμφώνοις πρὸς ἄλληλα, βάρβαρον μιᾷ κλήσει προσειπόντες αὐτὸ διὰ ταύτην τὴν μίαν κλῆσιν καὶ γένος ἓν αὐτὸ εἶναι προσδοκῶσιν· ἢ τὸν ἀριθμόν τις αὖ νομίζοι κατʼ εἴδη δύο διαιρεῖν μυριάδα ἀποτεμνόμενος ἀπὸ πάντων, ὡς ἓν εἶδος ἀποχωρίζων, καὶ τῷ λοιπῷ δὴ παντὶ θέμενος ἓν ὄνομα διὰ τὴν κλῆσιν αὖ καὶ τοῦτʼ ἀξιοῖ γένος ἐκείνου χωρὶς ἕτερον ἓν γίγνεσθαι. κάλλιον δέ που καὶ μᾶλλον κατʼ εἴδη καὶ δίχα διαιροῖτʼ ἄν, εἰ τὸν μὲν ἀριθμὸν ἀρτίῳ καὶ περιττῷ τις τέμνοι, τὸ δὲ αὖ τῶν ἀνθρώπων γένος ἄρρενι καὶ θήλει, Λυδοὺς δὲ ἢ Φρύγας ἤ τινας ἑτέρους πρὸς ἅπαντας τάττων ἀποσχίζοι τότε, ἡνίκα ἀποροῖ γένος ἅμα καὶ μέρος εὑρίσκειν ἑκάτερον τῶν σχισθέντων.
Y. Soc. Very true; but that’s just the trouble, Stranger: how can we get a clearer knowledge of class and part, and see that they are not the same thing, but different?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὀρθότατα· ἀλλὰ γὰρ τοῦτο αὐτό, ὦ ξένε, πῶς ἄν τις γένος καὶ μέρος ἐναργέστερον γνοίη, ὡς οὐ ταὐτόν ἐστον ἀλλʼ ἕτερον ἀλλήλοιν;
Str. Socrates, you most excellent young man, it is no small task you impose upon me. We have already strayed away from our subject more than we ought, and you wish us to wander still farther afield. So for the present let us return to our subject, as is proper; then we will go on the trail of this other matter by and by, when we have time. Only take very good care not to imagine that you ever heard me declare flatly— Y.
ΞΕ. ὦ βέλτιστε ἀνδρῶν, οὐ φαῦλον προστάττεις, Σώκρατες. ἡμεῖς μὲν καὶ νῦν μακροτέραν τοῦ δέοντος ἀπὸ τοῦ προτεθέντος λόγου πεπλανήμεθα, σὺ δὲ ἔτι πλέον ἡμᾶς κελεύεις πλανηθῆναι. νῦν μὲν οὖν, ὥσπερ εἰκός, ἐπανίωμεν πάλιν· ταῦτα δὲ εἰς αὖθις κατὰ σχολὴν καθάπερ ἰχνεύοντες μέτιμεν. οὐ μὴν ἀλλὰ τοῦτό γε αὖ παντάπασιν φύλαξαι, μή ποτε παρʼ ἐμοῦ δόξῃς αὐτὸ ἐναργῶς διωρισμένον ἀκηκοέναι.
Soc. What?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. That class and part are separate from one another.
ΞΕ. εἶδός τε καὶ μέρος ἕτερον ἀλλήλων εἶναι.
Y. Soc. But what did you say?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. That when there is a class of anything, it must necessarily be a part of the thing of which it is said to be a class; but there is no necessity that a part be also a class. Please always give this, rather than the other, as my doctrine.
ΞΕ. ὡς εἶδος μὲν ὅταν ᾖ του, καὶ μέρος αὐτὸ ἀναγκαῖον εἶναι τοῦ πράγματος ὅτουπερ ἂν εἶδος λέγηται· μέρος δὲ εἶδος οὐδεμία ἀνάγκη. ταύτῃ με ἢ ʼκείνῃ μᾶλλον, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἀεὶ φάθι λέγειν.
Y. Soc. I will do so.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ταῦτʼ ἔσται.
Str. Then please go on to the next point.
ΞΕ. φράσον δή μοι τὸ μετὰ τοῦτο.
Y. Soc. What is it?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ποῖον;
Str. That from which our present digression started. For I think it started when you were asked how the art of herding should be divided and said with great readiness that there were two kinds of living beings, the human race and a second one, a single class, comprising all the beasts.
ΞΕ. τὸ τῆς ἀποπλανήσεως ὁπόθεν ἡμᾶς δεῦρʼ ἤγαγεν. οἶμαι μὲν γὰρ μάλιστα, ὅθεν ἐρωτηθεὶς σὺ τὴν ἀγελαιοτροφίαν ὅπῃ διαιρετέον εἶπες μάλα προθύμως δύʼ εἶναι ζῴων γένη, τὸ μὲν ἀνθρώπινον, ἕτερον δὲ τῶν ἄλλων συμπάντων θηρίων ἕν.
Y. Soc. True.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἀληθῆ.
Str. And it was clear to me at the time that you removed a part and then thought that the remainder was one class because you were able to call them all by the same name of beasts.
ΞΕ. καὶ ἔμοιγε δὴ τότʼ ἐφάνης μέρος ἀφαιρῶν ἡγεῖσθαι καταλιπεῖν τὸ λοιπὸν αὖ πάντων γένος ἕν, ὅτι πᾶσι ταὐτὸν ἐπονομάζειν ἔσχες ὄνομα, θηρία καλέσας.
Y. Soc. That is true, too.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἦν καὶ ταῦτα οὕτως.
Str. But indeed, my most courageous young friend, perhaps, if there is any other animal capable of thought, such as the crane appears to be, or any other like creature, and it perchance gives names, just as you do, it might in its pride of self oppose cranes to all other animals, and group the rest, men included, under one head, calling them by one name, which might very well be that of beasts. Now let us try to be on our guard against all that sort of thing.
ΞΕ. τὸ δέ γε, ὦ πάντων ἀνδρειότατε, τάχʼ ἄν, εἴ που φρόνιμόν ἐστί τι ζῷον ἕτερον, οἷον δοκεῖ τὸ τῶν γεράνων, ἤ τι τοιοῦτον ἄλλο, ὃ κατὰ ταὐτὰ ἴσως διονομάζει καθάπερ καὶ σύ, γεράνους μὲν ἓν γένος ἀντιτιθὲν τοῖς ἄλλοις ζῴοις καὶ σεμνῦνον αὐτὸ ἑαυτό, τὰ δὲ ἄλλα μετὰ τῶν ἀνθρώπων συλλαβὸν εἰς ταὐτὸ οὐδὲν ἄλλο πλὴν ἴσως θηρία προσείποι. πειραθῶμεν οὖν ἡμεῖς ἐξευλαβεῖσθαι πάνθʼ ὁπόσα τοιαῦτα.
Y.Soc. How can we guard against it?
ΝΕ.ΣΩ. πῶς;
Str. By not dividing the whole class of living beings, that so we may avoid such errors.
ΞΕ. μὴ πᾶν τὸ τῶν ζῴων γένος διαιρούμενοι, ἵνα ἧττον αὐτὰ πάσχωμεν.
Y. Soc. Well, there is no need of dividing the whole.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐδὲν γὰρ δεῖ.
Str. No, certainly not, for it was in that way that we fell into our former error.
ΞΕ. καὶ γὰρ οὖν καὶ τότε ἡμαρτάνετο ταύτῃ.
Y. Soc. What do you mean?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί δή;
Str. That part of intellectual science which involves giving commands was a part of our animal-tending class, with especial reference to animals in herds, was it not?
ΞΕ. τῆς γνωστικῆς ὅσον ἐπιτακτικὸν ἡμῖν μέρος ἦν που τοῦ ζῳοτροφικοῦ γένους, ἀγελαίων μὴν ζῴων. ἦ γάρ;
Str. Well, even at that stage of our discussion all animals had already been divided into tame and wild. For if their nature admits of domestication they are called tame; if it does not, they are called wild.
ΞΕ. διῄρητο τοίνυν ἤδη καὶ τότε σύμπαν τὸ ζῷον τῷ τιθασῷ καὶ ἀγρίῳ. τὰ μὲν γὰρ ἔχοντα τιθασεύεσθαι φύσιν ἥμερα προσείρηται, τὰ δὲ μὴ ʼθέλοντα ἄγρια.
Y. Soc. Excellent.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. καλῶς.
Str. But the science we are hunting for was, and is, to be sought among tame creatures, more specifically creatures in herds.
ΞΕ. ἣν δέ γε θηρεύομεν ἐπιστήμην, ἐν τοῖς ἡμέροις ἦν τε καὶ ἔστιν, ἐπὶ τοῖς ἀγελαίοις μὴν ζητητέα θρέμμασιν.
Str. Let us, then, not make our division as we did before, with a view to all, nor in a hurry, with the idea that we may thus reach political science quickly, for that has already brought upon us the proverbial penalty.
ΞΕ. μὴ τοίνυν διαιρώμεθα ὥσπερ τότε πρὸς ἅπαντα ἀποβλέψαντες, μηδὲ σπεύσαντες, ἵνα δὴ ταχὺ γενώμεθα πρὸς τῇ πολιτικῇ. πεποίηκε γὰρ ἡμᾶς καὶ νῦν παθεῖν τὸ κατὰ τὴν παροιμίαν πάθος.
Y. Soc. What penalty?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ποῖον;
Str. The penalty of having made less speed, because we made too much haste and did not make our division right.
ΞΕ. οὐχ ἡσύχους εὖ διαιροῦντας ἠνυκέναι βραδύτερον.
Y. Soc. And it was a good thing for us, Stranger Str.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. καὶ καλῶς γε, ὦ ξένε, πεποίηκε.
I do not deny it. So let us begin again and try to divide the art of tending animals in common; for perhaps the information you desire so much will come to you in the ordinary course of our conversation better than by other means. Tell me— Y.
ΞΕ. ταῦτʼ ἔστω. πάλιν δʼ οὖν ἐξ ἀρχῆς τὴν κοινοτροφικὴν πειρώμεθα διαιρεῖν· ἴσως γὰρ καὶ τοῦτο ὃ σὺ προθυμῇ διαπεραινόμενος ὁ λόγος αὐτός σοι κάλλιον μηνύσει. καί μοι φράζε.
Soc. What?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ποῖον δή;
Str. Whether, as I suppose, you have often heard people speak of this,— for I know you never actually saw the preserves of fish in the Nile and in the ponds of the Persian king. But perhaps you have noticed the like in fountain-pools.
ΞΕ. τόδε, εἴ τινων πολλάκις ἄρα διακήκοας· οὐ γὰρ δὴ προστυχής γε αὐτὸς οἶδʼ ὅτι γέγονας ταῖς ἐν τῷ Νείλῳ τιθασείαις τῶν ἰχθύων καὶ τῶν ἐν ταῖς βασιλικαῖς λίμναις. ἐν μὲν γὰρ κρήναις τάχʼ ἂν ἴσως εἴης ᾐσθημένος.
Y. Soc. Yes, I have often seen the fish in fountain-pools and have heard many tales of those foreign preserves.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν καὶ ταῦτα τεθέαμαι κἀκεῖνα πολλῶν ἀκήκοα.
Str. And surely, even if you have not wandered over the plains of Thessaly, you have heard of goose-farms and crane-farms there and you believe that they exist.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν χηνοβωτίας γε καὶ γερανοβωτίας, εἰ καὶ μὴ πεπλάνησαι περὶ τὰ Θετταλικὰ πεδία, πέπυσαι γοῦν καὶ πιστεύεις εἶναι.
Y. Soc. Yes, of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί μήν;
Str. The reason why I asked you all these questions is that the rearing of flocks is in part aquatic and in part an affair of the dry land.
ΞΕ. τοῦδʼ ἕνεκά τοι πάντα ἠρώτησα ταῦτα, διότι τῆς τῶν ἀγελαίων τροφῆς ἔστι μὲν ἔνυδρον, ἔστι δὲ καὶ ξηροβατικόν.
Y. Soc. Yes, that is true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔστι γὰρ οὖν.
Str. Then do you agree that we ought to divide the art of tending animals in common into corresponding parts, assigning one part of it to each of these two, and calling one the art of aquatic-herding and the other the art of land-herding?
ΞΕ. ἆρʼ οὖν καὶ σοὶ συνδοκεῖ ταύτῃ δεῖν διχάζειν τὴν κοινοτροφικὴν ἐπιστήμην, ἐφʼ ἑκατέρῳ τούτων τὸ μέρος αὐτῆς ἐπινέμοντας ἑκάτερον, τὸ μὲν ἕτερον ὑγροτροφικὸν ὀνομάζοντας, τὸ δʼ ἕτερον ξηροτροφικόν;
Y. Soc. Yes, I agree.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔμοιγε.
Str. And surely we shall not have to ask to which of these two arts kingship belongs, for that is clear to everyone.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν καὶ τὸ βασιλικὸν οὕτως οὐ ζητήσομεν ὁποτέρας ἐστὶ τῆς τέχνης· δῆλον [δὴ] γὰρ παντί.
Y. Soc. Of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
Str. Anybody could doubtless make a division of the art of tending herds on land.
ΞΕ. πᾶς μὲν δὴ τό γε ξηροτροφικὸν τῆς ἀγελαιοτροφίας διέλοιτʼ ἂν φῦλον.
Y.Soc. What would the division be?
ΝΕ.ΣΩ. πῶς;
Str. Into the tending of flying and walking animals.
ΞΕ. τῷ πτηνῷ τε καὶ πεζῷ διορισάμενος.
Y. Soc. Very true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἀληθέστατα.
Str. And statesmanship is to be sought in connection with walking animals, is it not? Any fool, so to speak, would believe that, don’t you think?
ΞΕ. τί δέ; τὸ πολιτικὸν ἦ περὶ τὸ πεζὸν ζητητέον; ἢ οὐκ οἴει καὶ τὸν ἀφρονέστατον ὡς ἔπος εἰπεῖν δοξάζειν οὕτως;
Y. Soc. Of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔγωγε.
Str. And the art of tending animals that walk must, like an even number, be divided in half.
ΞΕ. τὴν δὲ πεζονομικήν, καθάπερ ἄρτι τὸν ἀριθμόν, δεῖ τεμνομένην δίχα ἀποφαίνειν.
Y. Soc. Evidently.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δῆλον.
Str. And now I think I see two paths leading in that direction in which our argument has started: the quicker way, by separating a relatively small part and a larger, and the other way, which is more in accord with what we said a while ago about the need of making the division as nearly in the middle as we can, but is longer. So we can proceed by whichever of the two we wish.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν ἐφʼ ὅ γε μέρος ὥρμηκεν ἡμῖν ὁ λόγος, ἐπʼ ἐκεῖνο δύο τινὲ καθορᾶν ὁδὼ τεταμένα φαίνεται, τὴν μὲν θάττω, πρὸς μέγα μέρος σμικρὸν διαιρουμένην, τὴν δέ, ὅπερ ἐν τῷ πρόσθεν ἐλέγομεν ὅτι δεῖ μεσοτομεῖν ὡς μάλιστα, τοῦτʼ ἔχουσαν μᾶλλον, μακροτέραν γε μήν. ἔξεστιν οὖν ὁποτέραν ἂν βουληθῶμεν, ταύτην πορευθῆναι.
Y. Soc. Can we not go by both?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τί δέ; ἀμφοτέρας ἀδύνατον;
Str. Not by both at once, silly boy; but obviously we can take them in turn.
ΞΕ. ἅμα γʼ, ὦ θαυμαστέ· ἐν μέρει γε μὴν δῆλον ὅτι δυνατόν.
Y. Soc. Then I choose both in turn.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἐν μέρει τοίνυν ἔγωγε ἀμφοτέρας αἱροῦμαι.
Str. That is easy enough, since we have but a short distance to go. At the beginning, certainly, or middle of our journey it would have been hard to comply with your demand. But now, since this is your wish, let us go first by the longer way, for we are fresher now and shall get along on it more easily. So attend to the division.
ΞΕ. ῥᾴδιον, ἐπειδὴ τὸ λοιπὸν βραχύ· κατʼ ἀρχὰς μὴν καὶ μεσοῦσιν ἅμα τῆς πορείας χαλεπὸν ἂν ἦν ἡμῖν τὸ πρόσταγμα. νῦν δʼ, ἐπειδὴ δοκεῖ ταύτῃ, τὴν μακροτέραν πρότερον ἴωμεν· νεαλέστεροι γὰρ ὄντες ῥᾷον αὐτὴν πορευσόμεθα. τὴν δὲ δὴ διαίρεσιν ὅρα.
Y. Soc. Go on.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. λέγε.
Str. The tame walking animals which live in herds are divided by nature into two classes.
ΞΕ. τὰ πεζὰ ἡμῖν τῶν ἡμέρων, ὅσαπερ ἀγελαῖα, διῃρημένα ἐστὶ φύσει δίχα.
Y. Soc. How by nature?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τίνι;
Str. Because one class is naturally without horns, and the other has horns.
ΞΕ. τῷ τῶν μὲν τὴν γένεσιν ἄκερων εἶναι, τῶν δὲ κερασφόρον.
Y. Soc. That is obvious.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. φαίνεται.
Str. Now divide the art of tending herds of walking animals into two parts, assigning one to each class of animals; and define the parts, for if you try to give them names, the matter will become needlessly complicated.
ΞΕ. τὴν δὴ πεζονομικὴν διελὼν ἀπόδος ἑκατέρῳ τῷ μέρει λόγῳ χρώμενος. ἂν γὰρ ὀνομάζειν αὐτὰ βουληθῇς, ἔσται σοι περιπεπλεγμένον μᾶλλον τοῦ δέοντος.
Y. Soc. How shall I speak of them then?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς οὖν χρὴ λέγειν;
Str. In this way: say that the science which tends herds of walking animals is divided into two parts, one of which is assigned to the horned portion of the herd, the other to the hornless portion.
ΞΕ. ὧδε· τῆς πεζονομικῆς ἐπιστήμης δίχα διαιρεθείσης τὸ μόριον θάτερον ἐπὶ τῷ κερασφόρῳ μέρει τῷ τῆς ἀγέλης ἐπιτετάχθαι, τὸ δὲ ἕτερον ἐπὶ τῷ τῆς ἀκεράτου.
Y. Soc. Assume that I have said that; for you have made it perfectly clear.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ταῦτʼ ἔστω ταύτῃ λεχθέντα· πάντως γὰρ ἱκανῶς δεδήλωται.
Str. And furthermore our “king” is very clearly the herdsman of a herd devoid of horns.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν ὅ γε βασιλεὺς ἡμῖν αὖ καταφανὴς ὅτι κολοβὸν ἀγέλην τινὰ κεράτων νομεύει.
Y. Soc. Of course; that is evident.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς γὰρ οὐ δῆλος;
Str. Let us then try to break up this herd and give the king the part that belongs to him.
ΞΕ. ταύτην τοίνυν καταθραύσαντες τὸ γιγνόμενον αὐτῷ πειρώμεθα ἀποδοῦναι.
Y. Soc. Very well.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ γε.
Str. Shall we make our division on the basis of having or not having cloven hoofs, or on that of mixing or not mixing the breed? You know what I mean.
ΞΕ. πότερον οὖν βούλει τῷ σχιστῷ τε καὶ τῷ καλουμένῳ μώνυχι διαιρεῖν αὐτὴν ἢ τῇ κοινογονίᾳ τε καὶ ἰδιογονίᾳ; μανθάνεις γάρ που.
Y. Soc. No. What is it?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. Why, I mean that horses and asses can breed from each other.
ΞΕ. ὅτι τὸ μὲν τῶν ἵππων καὶ ὄνων πέφυκεν ἐξ ἀλλήλων γεννᾶν.
Y. Soc. Oh yes.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ναί.
Str. But the rest of the herd of hornless tame animals cannot cross the breed.
ΞΕ. τὸ δέ γε λοιπὸν ἔτι τῆς λείας ἀγέλης τῶν ἡμέρων ἀμιγὲς γένει πρὸς ἄλληλα.
Y. Soc. That is true, of course.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
Str. Well then, does the statesman appear to have charge of a kind that mixes or of one that does not mix the breed?
ΞΕ. τί δʼ; ὁ πολιτικὸς ἄρʼ ἐπιμέλειαν ἔχειν φαίνεται πότερα κοινογενοῦς φύσεως ἤ τινος ἰδιογενοῦς;
Y. Soc. Evidently of one that is unmixed.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δῆλον ὅτι τῆς ἀμείκτου.
Str. So I suppose we must proceed as we have done heretofore and divide this into two parts.
ΞΕ. ταύτην δὴ δεῖ καθάπερ τὰ ἔμπροσθεν, ὡς ἔοικεν, ἡμᾶς δίχα διαστέλλειν.
Y. Soc. Yes, we must.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. δεῖ γὰρ οὖν.
Str. And yet tame gregarious animals have all, with the exception of about two species, been already divided; for dogs are not properly to be counted among gregarious creatures.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν τό γε ζῷον, ὅσον ἥμερον καὶ ἀγελαῖον, σχεδὸν πλὴν γενοῖν δυοῖν πᾶν ἤδη κατακεκερμάτισται. τὸ γὰρ τῶν κυνῶν οὐκ ἐπάξιον καταριθμεῖν γένος ὡς ἐν ἀγελαίοις θρέμμασιν.
Y. Soc. No, they are not. But how shall we divide the two species?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐ γὰρ οὖν. ἀλλὰ τίνι δὴ τὼ δύο διαιροῦμεν;
Str. As you and Theaetetus ought by rights to divide them, since you are interested in geometry.
ΞΕ. ὧιπερ καὶ δίκαιόν γε Θεαίτητόν τε καὶ σὲ διανέμειν, ἐπειδὴ καὶ γεωμετρίας ἅπτεσθον.
Y. Soc. How do you mean?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τῷ;
Str. By the diameter, of course, and again by the diameter of the square of the diameter.
ΞΕ. τῇ διαμέτρῳ δήπου καὶ πάλιν τῇ τῆς διαμέτρου διαμέτρῳ.
Y. Soc. What do you mean by that?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς εἶπες;
Str. Is the nature which our human race possesses related to walking in any other way than as the diameter which is the square root of two feet?
ΞΕ. ἡ φύσις, ἣν τὸ γένος ἡμῶν τῶν ἀνθρώπων κέκτηται, μῶν ἄλλως πως εἰς τὴν πορείαν πέφυκεν ἢ καθάπερ ἡ διάμετρος ἡ δυνάμει δίπους;
Y. Soc. No.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐκ ἄλλως.
Str. And the nature of the remaining species, again, considered from the point of view of the square root, is the diameter of the square of our root, if it is the nature of twice two feet.
ΞΕ. καὶ μὴν ἥ γε τοῦ λοιποῦ γένους πάλιν ἐστὶ κατὰ δύναμιν αὖ τῆς ἡμετέρας δυνάμεως διάμετρος, εἴπερ δυοῖν γέ ἐστι ποδοῖν δὶς πεφυκυῖα.
Y. Soc. Of course; and now I think I almost understand what you wish to make plain.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς δʼ οὐκ ἔστι; καὶ δὴ καὶ σχεδὸν ὃ βούλει δηλοῦν μανθάνω.
Str. Socrates, do we see that besides this something else has turned up in these divisions of ours which would be a famous joke?
ΞΕ. πρὸς δὴ τούτοις ἕτερον αὖ τι τῶν πρὸς γέλωτα εὐδοκιμησάντων ἄν, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἆρα καθορῶμεν ἡμῖν γεγονὸς ἐν τοῖς διῃρημένοις;
Y. Soc. No. What is it?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. Our human race shares the same lot and runs in the same heat as the most excellent and at the same time most easy-going race of creatures.
ΞΕ. τἀνθρώπινον ἡμῶν ἅμα γένος συνειληχὸς καὶ συνδεδραμηκὸς γένει τῷ τῶν ὄντων γενναιοτάτῳ καὶ ἅμα εὐχερεστάτῳ.
Y. Soc. Yes, I see that; it is a very queer result.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. καθορῶ καὶ μάλʼ ἀτόπως συμβαῖνον.
Str. Indeed? But is it not reasonable that they arrive last, who are the slowest?
ΞΕ. τί δʼ; οὐκ εἰκὸς ὕστατα ἀφικνεῖσθαι τὰ βραδύτατα;
Y. Soc. Yes, that is true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ναί, τοῦτό γε.
Str. And do we fail to notice this further point, that the king appears in a still more ridiculous light, running along with the herd and paired in the race with the man of all others who is most in training for a life of careless ease?
ΞΕ. τόδε δὲ οὐκ ἐννοοῦμεν, ὡς ἔτι γελοιότερος ὁ βασιλεὺς φαίνεται μετὰ τῆς ἀγέλης συνδιαθέων καὶ σύνδρομα πεπορευμένος τῷ τῶν ἀνδρῶν αὖ πρὸς τὸν εὐχερῆ βίον ἄριστα γεγυμνασμένῳ;
Y. Soc. Certainly he does.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. παντάπασι μὲν οὖν.
Str. For now, Socrates, we have shown more clearly the truth of that which we said yesterday in our search for the sophist.
ΞΕ. νῦν γάρ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἐκεῖνό ἐστι καταφανὲς μᾶλλον τὸ ῥηθὲν τότʼ ἐν τῇ περὶ τὸν σοφιστὴν ζητήσει.
Y. Soc. What was it?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. That this method of argument pays no more heed to the noble than to the ignoble, and no less honor to the small than to the great, but always goes on its own way to the most perfect truth.
ΞΕ. ὅτι τῇ τοιᾷδε μεθόδῳ τῶν λόγων οὔτε σεμνοτέρου μᾶλλον ἐμέλησεν ἢ μή, τόν τε σμικρότερον οὐδὲν ἠτίμακε πρὸ τοῦ μείζονος, ἀεὶ δὲ καθʼ αὑτὴν περαίνει τἀληθέστατον.
Y. Soc. So it seems.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ἔοικεν.
Str. Then shall I now, without waiting for you to ask me, guide you of my own accord along that shorter way referred to a moment ago that leads to the definition of the king?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν μετὰ τοῦτο, ἵνα μή με φθῇς ἐρωτήσας τὴν βραχυτέραν ὁδὸν ἥτις τότε ἦν ἐπὶ τὸν τοῦ βασιλέως ὅρον, αὐτός σοι πρότερον ἔλθω;
Y. Soc. By all means.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. σφόδρα γε.
Str. I say, then, that we ought at that time to have divided walking animals immediately into biped and quadruped, then seeing that the human race falls into the same division with the feathered creatures and no others, we must again divide the biped class into featherless and feathered, and when that division is made and the art of herding human beings is made plain, we ought to take the statesmanlike and kingly man and place him as a sort of charioteer therein, handing over to him the reins of the state, because that is his own proper science.
ΞΕ. λέγω δὴ δεῖν τότε εὐθὺς τὸ πεζὸν τῷ δίποδι πρὸς τὸ τετράπουν γένος διανεῖμαι, κατιδόντα δὲ τἀνθρώπινον ἔτι μόνῳ τῷ πτηνῷ συνειληχὸς τὴν δίποδα ἀγέλην πάλιν τῷ ψιλῷ καὶ τῷ πτεροφυεῖ τέμνειν, τμηθείσης δὲ αὐτῆς καὶ τότʼ ἤδη τῆς ἀνθρωπονομικῆς δηλωθείσης τέχνης, φέροντα τὸν πολιτικὸν καὶ βασιλικὸν οἷον ἡνίοχον εἰς αὐτὴν ἐνστήσαντα, παραδοῦναι τὰς τῆς πόλεως ἡνίας ὡς οἰκείας καὶ αὐτῷ ταύτης οὔσης τῆς ἐπιστήμης.
Y. Soc. You have cleared up the argument finely, and as if it were a debt you were paying, you threw in the digression as interest and for good measure.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. καλῶς καὶ καθαπερεὶ χρέος ἀπέδωκάς μοι τὸν λόγον, προσθεὶς τὴν ἐκτροπὴν οἷον τόκον καὶ ἀναπληρώσας αὐτόν.
Str. Now let us go back to the beginning and join together the definition of the name of the statesman’s art link by link to the end.
ΞΕ. φέρε δὴ καὶ συνείρωμεν ἐπανελθόντες ἐπὶ τὴν ἀρχὴν μέχρι τῆς τελευτῆς τὸν λόγον τοῦ ὀνόματος τῆς τοῦ πολιτικοῦ τέχνης.
Y. Soc. By all means.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
Str. In the first place we said that intellectual science had a part that gives commands; and a portion of this was called by a comparison the part that gives its own commands; and again the art of rearing living beings was singled out, which is by no means the smallest part of the art which gives its own commands; and a class of rearing living beings was herd-tending, and a part of this again the herding of walking animals; and from the herding of walking animals the art of rearing those without horns was divided. And of this in turn one part will have to be treated as no less than threefold, if it is to be called by one comprehensive name, and it will be called (1) the science (2) of tending herds (3) which do not cross breeds. But the only possible further subdivision of this is the art of herding human beings, and this is at last what we are looking for, the single art called both kingly and statesmanlike.
ΞΕ. τῆς γνωστικῆς τοίνυν ἐπιστήμης ἡμῖν ἦν κατʼ ἀρχὰς μέρος ἐπιτακτικόν· τούτου δὲ ἀπεικασθὲν τὸ μόριον αὐτεπιτακτικὸν ἐρρήθη. ζῳοτροφικὴ δὲ πάλιν αὐτεπιτακτικῆς οὐ τὸ σμικρότατον τῶν γενῶν ἀπεσχίζετο· καὶ ζῳοτροφικῆς εἶδος ἀγελαιοτροφικόν, ἀγελαιοτροφικοῦ δʼ αὖ πεζονομικόν· τοῦ δὲ πεζονομικοῦ μάλιστα ἀπετέμνετο τέχνη τῆς ἀκεράτου φύσεως θρεπτική. ταύτης δʼ αὖ τὸ μέρος οὐκ ἔλαττον τριπλοῦν συμπλέκειν ἀναγκαῖον, ἂν εἰς ἕν τις αὐτὸ ὄνομα συναγαγεῖν βουληθῇ, γενέσεως ἀμείκτου νομευτικὴν ἐπιστήμην προσαγορεύων. τὸ δʼ ἀπὸ τούτου τμῆμα, ἐπὶ ποίμνῃ δίποδι μέρος ἀνθρωπονομικὸν ἔτι λειφθὲν μόνον, τοῦτʼ αὐτό ἐστιν ἤδη τὸ ζητηθέν, ἅμα βασιλικὸν ταὐτὸν κληθὲν καὶ πολιτικόν.
Y. Soc. That is perfectly true.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. παντάπασι μὲν οὖν.
Str. And yet, Socrates, have we truly accomplished this, exactly as you have said?
ΞΕ. ἆρά γʼ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἀληθῶς ἡμῖν τοῦτο καθάπερ σὺ νῦν εἴρηκας οὕτως ἐστὶ καὶ πεπραγμένον;
Y. Soc. Accomplished what?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον δή;
Str. The perfectly satisfactory discussion of our subject. Or is our investigation incomplete in just this detail, that we have given a definition after a fashion, but have not perfectly completed it?
ΞΕ. τὸ παντάπασιν ἱκανῶς εἰρῆσθαι τὸ προτεθέν; ἢ τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ καὶ μάλιστα ἡ ζήτησις ἐλλείπει, τὸ τὸν λόγον εἰρῆσθαι μέν πως, οὐ μὴν παντάπασί γε τελέως ἀπειργάσθαι;
Y. Soc. What do you mean?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς εἶπες;
Str. I will try to make still plainer to us both the thought which I now have in mind.
ΞΕ. ἐγὼ νῷν πειράσομαι τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ ὃ διανοοῦμαι νῦν ἔτι μᾶλλον δηλῶσαι.
Y. Soc. Please do so.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. λέγοις ἄν.
Str. We found just now that there were many arts of herding, and one of them was the art of statesmanship, which was the care of one particular kind of herd, did we not?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν τῶν νομευτικῶν ἡμῖν πολλῶν φανεισῶν ἄρτι τεχνῶν μία τις ἦν ἡ πολιτικὴ καὶ μιᾶς τινος ἀγέλης ἐπιμέλεια;
Str. And our argument defined this, not as the tending of horses or other beasts, but as the science of tending men in common.
ΞΕ. ταύτην δέ γε διώριζεν ὁ λόγος οὐχ ἵππων εἶναι τροφὸν οὐδʼ ἄλλων θηρίων, ἀλλʼ ἀνθρώπων κοινοτροφικὴν ἐπιστήμην.
Y. Soc. Yes, it did.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὕτως.
Str. Let us, then, observe the point of difference between kings and all other herdsmen.
ΞΕ. τὸ δὴ τῶν νομέων πάντων διάφορον καὶ τὸ τῶν βασιλέων θεασώμεθα.
Y. Soc. What point of difference?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. τὸ ποῖον;
Str. Let us see whether anyone who is designated by the name of another art says and claims that he is fellow manager of the herd in common with any of the other kinds of herdsmen.
ΞΕ. εἴ τις τῶν ἄλλων τῳ, τέχνης ἄλλης ὄνομα ἔχων, κοινῇ τῆς ἀγέλης σύντροφος εἶναί φησι καὶ προσποιεῖται.
Y. Soc. What do you mean?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. πῶς φῄς;
Str. For instance, merchants, husbandmen, and all who prepare grain for use, and also gymnastic trainers and physicians would certainly all dispute with the herdsmen of humanity, whom we have called statesmen, and would assert that they themselves take care of the tending of humanity, and not the tending of the common herd only, but even that of the rulers themselves, would they not?
ΞΕ. οἷον οἱ ἔμποροι καὶ γεωργοὶ καὶ σιτουργοὶ πάντες, καὶ πρὸς τούτοις γυμνασταὶ καὶ τὸ τῶν ἰατρῶν γένος, οἶσθʼ ὅτι τοῖς περὶ τὰ ἀνθρώπινα νομεῦσιν, οὓς πολιτικοὺς ἐκαλέσαμεν, παντάπασι τῷ λόγῳ διαμάχοιντʼ ἂν οὗτοι σύμπαντες, ὡς σφεῖς τῆς τροφῆς ἐπιμελοῦνται τῆς ἀνθρωπίνης, οὐ μόνον ἀγελαίων ἀνθρώπων ἀλλὰ καὶ τῆς τῶν ἀρχόντων αὐτῶν;
Y. Soc. And would they be right?
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐκοῦν ὀρθῶς ἂν λέγοιεν;
Str. Perhaps. We will examine that matter; but this we know, that no one will ever raise such a contention against any neatherd, but the herdsman himself tends the herd, he is their physician, he is their matchmaker, and he alone knows the midwife’s science of aiding at the birth of their offspring. Moreover, so far as the nature of the creatures allows them to enjoy sport or music, no one can enliven or soothe them better than he; whether with instruments or merely with his voice he performs the music best suited to his own herd; and the same applies to the other herdsmen. Is not that the case?
ΞΕ. ἴσως. καὶ τοῦτο μὲν ἐπισκεψόμεθα, τόδε δὲ ἴσμεν, ὅτι βουκόλῳ γε οὐδεὶς ἀμφισβητήσει περὶ τούτων οὐδενός, ἀλλʼ αὐτὸς τῆς ἀγέλης τροφὸς ὁ βουφορβός, αὐτὸς ἰατρός, αὐτὸς οἷον νυμφευτὴς καὶ περὶ τοὺς τῶν γιγνομένων τόκους καὶ λοχείας μόνος ἐπιστήμων τῆς μαιευτικῆς. ἔτι τοίνυν παιδιᾶς καὶ μουσικῆς ἐφʼ ὅσον αὐτοῦ τὰ θρέμματα φύσει μετείληφεν, οὐκ ἄλλος κρείττων παραμυθεῖσθαι καὶ κηλῶν πραΰνειν, μετά τε ὀργάνων καὶ ψιλῷ τῷ στόματι τὴν τῆς αὑτοῦ ποίμνης ἄριστα μεταχειριζόμενος μουσικήν. καὶ δὴ καὶ τῶν ἄλλων πέρι νομέων ὁ αὐτὸς τρόπος. ἦ γάρ;
Y. Soc. You are quite right.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. ὀρθότατα.
Str. Then how can our discourse about the king be right and free from error, when we pick him out alone as herdsman and tender of the human herd, while countless others dispute his claim?
ΞΕ. πῶς οὖν ἡμῖν ὁ λόγος ὀρθὸς φανεῖται καὶ ἀκέραιος ὁ περὶ τοῦ βασιλέως, ὅταν αὐτὸν νομέα καὶ τροφὸν ἀγέλης ἀνθρωπίνης θῶμεν μόνον ἐκκρίνοντες μυρίων ἄλλων ἀμφισβητούντων;
Y. Soc. It cannot possibly be right.
ΝΕ. ΣΩ. οὐδαμῶς.
Str. We suspected a little while ago that although we might be outlining a sort of kingly shape we had not yet perfected an accurate portrait of the statesman, and could not do so until, by removing those who crowd about him and contend with him for a share in his herdsmanship, we separated him from them and made him stand forth alone and uncontaminated. Was our fear justified?
ΞΕ. οὐκοῦν ὀρθῶς ὀλίγον ἔμπροσθεν ἐφοβήθημεν ὑποπτεύσαντες μὴ λέγοντες μέν τι τυγχάνοιμεν σχῆμα βασιλικόν, οὐ μὴν ἀπειργασμένοι γε εἶμέν πω διʼ ἀκριβείας τὸν πολιτικόν, ἕως ἂν τοὺς περικεχυμένους αὐτῷ καὶ τῆς συννομῆς αὐτῷ ἀντιποιουμένους περιελόντες καὶ χωρίσαντες ἀπʼ ἐκείνων καθαρὸν μόνον αὐτὸν ἀποφήνωμεν;