---
title: "Symposium · Συμπόσιον"
author: "Xenophon"
translator: "Otis Johnson Todd"
languages: [grc, en]
shelf: "Classical Greek"
section: 6 of 9
url: https://scriptura.si/works/xenophon-symposium/6/
cite: "Xenophon, tr. Otis Johnson Todd, Symposium · Συμπόσιον, section 6. Scriptura (scriptura.si), https://scriptura.si/works/xenophon-symposium/6/"
---

# Symposium · Συμπόσιον

*Xenophon, tr. Otis Johnson Todd*

Socrates at a dinner party, with dancers, jokes and a speech on love.

> Greek: ed. Edgar Carew Marchant, from the Perseus Digital Library (canonical-greekLit, tlg0032.tlg004, CC BY-SA 4.0).

> English: Otis Johnson Todd, from the Perseus Digital Library (tlg0032.tlg004.perseus-eng2). Notes are not included.

> Rows follow the references the two texts share (books, chapters and sections), cut where both reach the end of a sentence.

## 6. Chapter 6

Source: https://scriptura.si/works/xenophon-symposium/6/ · cite a paragraph as https://scriptura.si/works/xenophon-symposium/6/#p-N

[¶0] 1. At this some of the company urged Critobulus to take his kisses, the need of victory; others advised him to get the consent of the young people’s legal guardian; and others indulged in other badinage. But even then Hermogenes kept silent. And Socrates, calling him by name, inquired, Hermogenes, could you define “convivial unpleasantness” for us? If you ask me what it actually is, he answered, I do not know; but I am willing to tell you what I think it is. Soc. Very well, tell us that.

> Greek: 1. ἐκ δὲ τούτου οἱ μὲν τὰ νικητήρια φιλήματα ἀπολαμβάνειν τὸν Κριτόβουλον ἐκέλευον, οἱ δὲ τὸν κύριον πείθειν, οἱ δὲ καὶ ἄλλα ἔσκωπτον. ὁ δὲ Ἑρμογένης κἀνταῦθα ἐσιώπα. καὶ ὁ Σωκράτης ὀνομάσας αὐτόν, ἔχοις ἄν, ἔφη, ὦ Ἑρμόγενες, εἰπεῖν ἡμῖν τί ἐστὶ παροινία; καὶ ὃς ἀπεκρίνατο· εἰ μὲν ὅ τι ἐστὶν ἐρωτᾷς, οὐκ οἶδα· τὸ μέντοι μοι δοκοῦν εἴποιμʼ ἄν.

[¶1] 2. Herm. My definition of “convivial unpleasantness” is the annoying of one’s companions at their drink. Soc. Well, do you realize that at the present moment you conform to the definition by annoying us with your taciturnity? Herm. What! while you are talking? No, but in the intervals. Why, don’t you see that a person could not insert even a hair in the interstices of your talk, much less a word?

> Greek: 2. ἀλλʼ, ὃ δοκεῖ, τοῦτʼ, ἔφη. τὸ τοίνυν παρʼ οἶνον λυπεῖν τοὺς συνόντας, τοῦτʼ ἐγὼ κρίνω παροινίαν. οἶσθʼ οὖν, ἔφη, ὅτι καὶ σὺ νῦν ἡμᾶς λυπεῖς σιωπῶν; ἦ καὶ ὅταν λέγητʼ; ἔφη. οὐκ ἀλλʼ ὅταν διαλίπωμεν. ἦ οὖν λέληθέ σε ὅτι μεταξὺ τοῦ ὑμᾶς λέγειν οὐδʼ ἂν τρίχα, μὴ ὅτι λόγον ἄν τις παρείρειε;

[¶2] 3. Callias, said Socrates, appealing to him, could you come to the rescue of a man hard put to it for an answer? Yes, indeed, said he: we are absolutely quiet every time the flute is played. Hermogenes retorted, Is it your wish that I should converse with you to the accompaniment of a flute, the way the actor Nicostratus used to recite tetrameter verses?

> Greek: 3. καὶ ὁ Σωκράτης, ὦ Καλλία, ἔχοις ἄν τι, ἔφη, ἀνδρὶ ἐλεγχομένῳ βοηθῆσαι; ἔγωγʼ, ἔφη. ὅταν γὰρ ὁ αὐλὸς φθέγγηται, παντάπασι σιωπῶμεν. καὶ ὁ Ἑρμογένης, ἦ οὖν βούλεσθε, ἔφη, ὥσπερ Νικόστρατος ὁ ὑποκριτὴς τετράμετρα πρὸς τὸν αὐλὸν κατέλεγεν, οὕτω καὶ ὑπὸ τοῦ αὐλοῦ ὑμῖν διαλέγωμαι;

[¶3] 4. In Heaven’s name, do so, Hermogenes, urged Socrates. For I believe that precisely as a song is more agreeable when accompanied on the flute, so your discourse would be embellished somewhat by the music, especially if you were to gesticulate and pose, like the flute-girl, to point your words.

> Greek: 4. καὶ ὁ Σωκράτης, πρὸς τῶν θεῶν, ἔφη, Ἑρμόγενες, οὕτω ποίει. οἶμαι γάρ, ὥσπερ ἡ ᾠδὴ ἡδίων πρὸς τὸν αὐλόν, οὕτω καὶ τοὺς σοὺς λόγους ἡδύνεσθαι ἄν τι ὑπὸ τῶν φθόγγων, ἄλλως τε καὶ εἰ μορφάζοις, ὥσπερ ἡ αὐλητρίς, καὶ σὺ πρὸς τὰ λεγόμενα.

[¶4] 5. What is the tune to be, asked Callias, when Antisthenes here gets some one at the banquet cornered in an argument? For the discomfited disputant, said Antisthenes, I think the appropriate music would be a hissing.

> Greek: 5. καὶ ὁ Καλλίας ἔφη· ὅταν οὖν ὁ Ἀντισθένης ὅδʼ ἐλέγχῃ τινὰ ἐν τῷ συμποσίῳ, τί ἔσται τὸ αὔλημα; καὶ ὁ Ἀντισθένης εἶπε· Τῷ μὲν ἐλεγχομένῳ οἶμαι ἄν, ἔφη, πρέπειν συριγμόν.

[¶5] 6. The Syracusan, seeing that with such conversation going on the banqueters were paying no attention to his show, but were enjoying one another’s company, said spitefully to Socrates, Socrates, are you the one nick-named the “Thinker”? Well, isn’t that preferable, he rejoined, to being called the “Thoughtless”? Yes, if it were not that you are supposed to be a thinker on celestial subjects.

> Greek: 6. τοιούτων δὲ λόγων ὄντων ὡς ἑώρα ὁ Συρακόσιος τῶν μὲν αὑτοῦ ἐπιδειγμάτων ἀμελοῦντας, ἀλλήλοις δὲ ἡδομένους, φθονῶν τῷ Σωκράτει εἶπεν· ἆρα σύ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ὁ φροντιστὴς ἐπικαλούμενος; οὐκοῦν κάλλιον, ἔφη, ἢ εἰ ἀφρόντιστος ἐκαλούμην. εἰ μή γε ἐδόκεις τῶν μετεώρων φροντιστὴς εἶναι.

[¶6] 7. Do you know, asked Socrates, anything more celestial than the gods? Syr. No; but that is not what people say you are concerned with, but rather with the most unbeneficial things. Soc. Even granting the expression, it would still be the gods that are my concern; for (1) they cause rain under the heavens and so are “beneficial”, and (2) they produce light, also under the heavens, and are thus again “beneficial”. If the pun is strained, he added, you have only yourself to blame for it, for annoying me.

> Greek: 7. οἶσθα οὖν, ἔφη ὁ Σωκράτης, μετεωρότερόν τι τῶν θεῶν; ἀλλʼ οὐ μὰ Δίʼ, ἔφη, οὐ τούτων σε λέγουσιν ἐπιμελεῖσθαι, ἀλλὰ τῶν ἀνωφελεστάτων. οὐκοῦν καὶ οὕτως ἄν, ἔφη, θεῶν ἐπιμελοίμην· ἄνωθεν μέν γε ὕοντες ὠφελοῦσιν, ἄνωθεν δὲ φῶς παρέχουσιν. εἰ δὲ ψυχρὰ λέγω, σὺ αἴτιος, ἔφη, πράγματά μοι παρέχων.

[¶7] 8. Syr. Well, let that pass. But tell me the distance between us in flea’s feet; for people say that your geometry includes such measurements as that. At this Antisthenes said to Philip: You are clever at hitting off a person’s likeness; wouldn’t you say that our friend here resembles one with a penchant for abuse? Yes, indeed, came the answer; and I see a resemblance in him to many another kind of person, too.

> Greek: 8. ταῦτα μέν, ἔφη, ἔα· ἀλλʼ εἰπέ μοι πόσους ψύλλα πόδας ἐμοῦ ἀπέχει. ταῦτα γάρ σέ φασι γεωμετρεῖν. καὶ ὁ Ἀντισθένης εἶπε· σὺ μέντοι δεινὸς εἶ, ὦ Φίλιππε, εἰκάζειν· οὐ δοκεῖ σοι ὁ ἀνὴρ οὗτος λοιδορεῖσθαι βουλομένῳ ἐοικέναι; ναὶ μὰ τὸν Δίʼ, ἔφη, καὶ ἄλλοις γε πολλοῖς.

[¶8] 9. Nevertheless, interposed Socrates, do not draw the comparison, lest you take on a similar likeness to one stooping to abuse. But suppose I am likening him to all the upright, the very elite; then I should deserve to be compared to a eulogist, rather than to a detractor. Ah, you resemble the latter right now, for you are asserting that every one is better than he.

> Greek: 9. ἀλλʼ ὅμως, ἔφη ὁ Σωκράτης, σὺ αὐτὸν μὴ εἴκαζε, ἵνα μὴ καὶ σὺ λοιδορουμένῳ ἐοίκῃς. ἀλλʼ εἴπερ γε τοῖς πᾶσι καλοῖς καὶ τοῖς βελτίστοις εἰκάζω αὐτόν, ἐπαινοῦντι μᾶλλον ἢ λοιδορουμένῳ δικαίως ἂν εἰκάζοι μέ τις. καὶ νῦν σύγε λοιδορουμένῳ ἔοικας, εἰ πάντʼ αὐτοῦ βελτίων φῂς εἶναι.

[¶9] 10. Would you have me compare him to those who excel him in villainy? No, not those, either. What, to no one? No; don’t compare him to any one in any particular. But if I hold my peace, I do not understand how I am going to render services suitable to such a fine dinner. That is easily effected, said Socrates, if you will be reticent on matters that should not be talked about. Thus was quenched this bit of convivial unpleasantness.

> Greek: 10. ἀλλὰ βούλει πονηροτέροις εἰκάζω αὐτόν; μηδὲ πονηροτέροις. ἀλλὰ μηδενί; μηδενὶ μηδὲ τούτων εἴκαζε. ἀλλʼ οὐ μέντοι γε σιωπῶν οἶδα ὅπως ἄξια τοῦ δείπνου ἐργάσομαι. καὶ ῥᾳδίως γʼ, ἂν ἃ μὴ δεῖ λέγειν, ἔφη, σιωπᾷς. αὕτη μὲν δὴ ἡ παροινία οὕτω κατεσβέσθη.