805d. For in truth we ought to conceive of the matter in this light. Suppose that women do not share with men in the whole of their mode of life, must they not have a different system of their own?
805d. καὶ γὰρ οὖν οὑτωσί πως δεῖ περὶ αὐτῶν διανοηθῆναι. φέρε, μὴ μετεχουσῶν ἀνδράσι γυναικῶν κοινῇ τῆς ζωῆς πάσης, μῶν οὐκ ἀνάγκη γενέσθαι γέ τινα τάξιν ἑτέραν αὐταῖς;
Clin. They must.
ΚΛ. ἀνάγκη μὲν οὖν.
Ath. Then which of the systems now in vogue shall we prescribe in preference to that fellowship which we are now imposing upon them? Shall it be that of the Thracians, and many other tribes, who employ their women in tilling the ground and minding oxen and sheep and toiling just like slaves?
ΑΘ. τίνα οὖν ἔμπροσθεν τῶν νῦν ἀποδεδειγμένων θεῖμεν ἂν τῆς κοινωνίας ταύτης ἣν νῦν αὐταῖς ἡμεῖς προστάττομεν; πότερον ἣν Θρᾷκες ταῖς γυναιξὶν χρῶνται καὶ πολλὰ ἕτερα γένη, γεωργεῖν τε καὶ βουκολεῖν καὶ ποιμαίνειν καὶ διακονεῖν μηδὲν διαφερόντως τῶν δούλων;
805e. Or that which obtains with us and all the people of our district? The way women are treated with us at present is this—we huddle all our goods together, as the saying goes, within four walls, and then hand over the dispensing of them to the women, together with the control of the shuttles and all kinds of wool-work.
805e. ἢ καθάπερ ἡμεῖς ἅπαντές τε οἱ περὶ τὸν τόπον ἐκεῖνον; νῦν γὰρ δὴ τό γε παρʼ ἡμῖν ὧδέ ἐστιν περὶ τούτων γιγνόμενον· εἴς τινα μίαν οἴκησιν συμφορήσαντες, τὸ λεγόμενον, πάντα χρήματα, παρέδομεν ταῖς γυναιξὶν διαταμιεύειν τε καὶ κερκίδων ἄρχειν καὶ πάσης ταλασίας.
806. Ath. Or again, shall we prescribe for them, Megillus, that midway system, the Laconian?
806. ΑΘ.ἢ τὸ τούτων δὴ διὰ μέσου φῶμεν, ὦ Μέγιλλε, τὸ Λακωνικόν;
806a. Must the girls share in gymnastics and music, and the women abstain from wool-work, but weave themselves instead a life that is not trivial at all nor useless, but arduous, advancing as it were halfway in the path of domestic tendance and management and child-nurture, but taking no share in military service; so that, even if it should chance to be necessary for them to fight in defence of their city and their children, they will be unable to handle with skill either a bow (like the Amazons) or any other missile, nor could they take spear and shield, after the fashion of the Goddess, so as to be able nobly to resist the wasting of their native land, and to strike terror—if nothing more—into the enemy at the sight of them marshalled in battle-array?
806a. κόρας μὲν γυμνασίων μετόχους οὔσας ἅμα καὶ μουσικῆς ζῆν δεῖν, γυναῖκας δὲ ἀργοὺς μὲν ταλασίας, ἀσκητικὸν δέ τινα βίον καὶ οὐδαμῶς φαῦλον οὐδʼ εὐτελῆ διαπλέκειν, θεραπείας δὲ καὶ ταμιείας αὖ καὶ παιδοτροφίας εἴς τι μέσον ἀφικνεῖσθαι, τῶν δʼ εἰς τὸν πόλεμον μὴ κοινωνούσας, ὥστε οὐδʼ εἴ τίς ποτε διαμάχεσθαι περὶ πόλεώς τε καὶ παίδων ἀναγκαία τύχη γίγνοιτο, οὔτʼ ἂν τόξων, ὥς τινες Ἀμαζόνες, οὔτʼ ἄλλης κοινωνῆσαί ποτε βολῆς μετὰ τέχνης δυνάμεναι, οὐδὲ ἀσπίδα καὶ δόρυ λαβοῦσαι μιμήσασθαι τὴν θεόν, ὡς πορθουμένης αὐταῖς τῆς πατρίδος γενναίως ἀντιστάσας, φόβον γε, εἰ μηδὲν μεῖζον, πολεμίοισι δύνασθαι παρασχεῖν ἐν τάξει τινὶ κατοφθείσας;
806b. If they lived in this manner, they certainly would not dare to adopt the fashion of the Sauromatides, whose women would seem like men beside them. So in regard to this matter, let who will commend your Laconian lawgivers:
806b. Σαυρομάτιδας δὲ οὐδʼ ἂν τὸ παράπαν τολμήσειαν μιμήσασθαι τοῦτον τὸν τρόπον διαβιοῦσαι, παρὰ γυναῖκας δὲ αὐτὰς ἄνδρες ἂν αἱ ἐκείνων γυναῖκες φανεῖεν.
806c. as to my view, it must stand as it is. The lawgiver ought to be whole-hearted, not half-hearted,—letting the female sex indulge in luxury and expense and disorderly ways of life, while supervising the male sex; for thus he is actually bequeathing to the State the half only, instead of the whole, of a life of complete prosperity.
806c. ταῦτʼ οὖν ὑμῶν τοὺς νομοθέτας ὁ μὲν βουλόμενος ἐπαινεῖν ἐπαινείτω, τὸ δʼ ἐμὸν οὐκ ἄλλως ἂν λεχθείη· τέλεον γὰρ καὶ οὐ διήμισυν δεῖν τὸν νομοθέτην εἶναι, τὸ θῆλυ μὲν ἀφιέντα τρυφᾶν καὶ ἀναλίσκειν διαίταις ἀτάκτως χρώμενον, τοῦ δὲ ἄρρενος ἐπιμεληθέντα, τελέως σχεδὸν εὐδαίμονος ἥμισυ βίου καταλείπειν ἀντὶ διπλασίου τῇ πόλει.
Meg. What are we to do, Clinias? Shall we allow the Stranger to run down our Sparta in this fashion?
ΜΕ. τί δράσομεν, ὦ Κλεινία; τὸν ξένον ἐάσομεν τὴν Σπάρτην ἡμῖν οὕτω καταδραμεῖν;
806d. Clin. Yes: now that we have granted him free speech we must let him be, until we have discussed the laws fully.
806d. ΚΛ. ναί· δεδομένης γὰρ αὐτῷ παρρησίας ἐατέον, ἕως ἂν διεξέλθωμεν πάντῃ ἱκανῶς τοὺς νόμους.
Meg. You are right.
ΜΕ. ὀρθῶς λέγεις.
Ath. May I, then, endeavor without more delay to proceed with my exposition?
ΑΘ. οὐκοῦν τὰ μετὰ ταῦτα ἤδη σχεδὸν ἐμὸν πειρᾶσθαι φράζειν;
Clin. By all means.
ΚΛ. πῶς γὰρ οὔ;
Ath. What manner of life would men live, supposing that they possessed a moderate supply of all the necessaries, and that they had entrusted all the crafts to other hands, and that their farms were hired out to slaves, and yielded them produce enough for their modest needs? Let us further suppose that they had public mess-rooms—separate rooms for men, and others close by for their households, including the girls and their mothers— Ath.
ΑΘ. τίς δὴ τρόπος ἀνθρώποις γίγνοιτʼ ἂν τοῦ βίου, οἷσιν τὰ μὲν ἀναγκαῖα εἴη κατεσκευασμένα μέτρια, τὰ δὲ τῶν τεχνῶν ἄλλοις παραδεδομένα, γεωργίαι δὲ ἐκδεδομέναι δούλοις ἀπαρχὴν τῶν ἐκ τῆς γῆς ἀποτελοῦσιν ἱκανὴν ἀνθρώποις ζῶσι κοσμίως, συσσίτια δὲ κατεσκευασμένα εἴη χωρὶς μὲν τὰ τῶν ἀνδρῶν, ἐγγὺς δʼ ἐχόμενα τὰ τῶν αὐτοῖς οἰκείων, παίδων τε ἅμα θηλειῶν καὶ τῶν μητέρων αὐταῖς,
807. and that each of these rooms was in charge of a master or mistress, to dismiss the company and to watch over their behavior daily; and, at the close of the meal, that the master and all the company poured a libation in honor of those gods to whom that night and day were dedicated, and so finally retired home.
807. ΑΘ. ἄρχουσιν δὲ καὶ ἀρχούσαις εἴη προστεταγμένα λύειν ταῦτα ἑκάστοις τὰ συσσίτια πάντα, καθʼ ἑκάστην ἡμέραν θεασαμένους καὶ ἰδόντας τὴν διαγωγὴν τὴν τῶν συσσίτων, μετὰ δὲ ταῦτα σπείσαντας τόν τε ἄρχοντα καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους οἷς ἂν τυγχάνῃ θεοῖς ἡ τότε νύξ τε καὶ ἡμέρα καθιερωμένη, κατὰ ταῦτα οὕτως οἴκαδε πορεύεσθαι;
807a. Supposing them to be thus organized, is there no necessary work, of a really appropriate kind, left for them, but must every one of them continue fattening himself like a beast? That, we assert, is neither right nor good; nor is it possible for one who lives thus to miss his due reward; and the due reward of an idle beast, fattened in sloth, is, as a rule, to fall a prey to another beast—one of those which are worn to skin and bone through toil hardily endured.
807a. τοῖς δὴ ταύτῃ κεκοσμημένοις ἆρα οὐδὲν λειπόμενόν ἐστιν ἀναγκαῖόν τε ἔργον καὶ παντάπασι προσῆκον, ἀλλʼ ἐν τρόπῳ βοσκήματος ἕκαστον πιαινόμενον αὐτῶν δεῖ ζῆν; οὔκουν τό γε δίκαιόν φαμεν οὐδὲ καλόν, οὐδʼ οἷόν τε τὸν ζῶντα οὕτως ἀτυχῆσαι τοῦ προσήκοντος, προσήκει δὲ ἀργῷ καὶ ῥᾳθύμως καταπεπιασμένῳ ζῴῳ σχεδὸν ὑπʼ ἄλλου διαρπασθῆναι ζῴου τῶν σφόδρα τετρυχωμένων μετὰ ἀνδρείας τε ἅμα καὶ τῶν πόνων.
807b. Now it is probable that if we look to find this state of leisure fully realized exactly as described, we shall be disappointed, so long as women and children and houses remain private, and all these things are established as the private property of individuals; but if the second-best State, as now described, could exist, we might be well content with it.
807b. ταῦτα οὖν δὴ διʼ ἀκριβείας μὲν ἱκανῆς, ὡς καὶ νῦν, εἰ ζητοῖμεν ἄν, ἴσως οὐκ ἄν ποτε γένοιτο, μέχριπερ ἂν γυναῖκές τε καὶ παῖδες οἰκήσεις τε ἴδιαι καὶ ἰδίως ἅπαντʼ ᾖ τὰ τοιαῦτα ἑκάστοις ἡμῶν κατεσκευασμένα· τὰ δὲ μετʼ ἐκεῖνʼ αὖ δεύτερα τὰ νῦν λεγόμενα εἰ γίγνοιτο ἡμῖν, γίγνοιτο ἂν καὶ μάλα μετρίως.
807c. And, we assert, there does remain for men living this life a task that is by no means small or trivial, but rather one that a just law imposes upon them as the weightiest task of all. For as compared with the life that aims at a Pythian or Olympian victory and is wholly lacking in leisure for other tasks, that life we speak of—which most truly deserves the name of “life”—is doubly (nay, far more than doubly) lacking in leisure, seeing that it is occupied with the care of bodily and spiritual excellence in general.
807c. ἔργον δὲ δὴ τοῖς οὕτω ζῶσίν φαμεν οὐ τὸ σμικρότατον οὐδὲ τὸ φαυλότατον λείπεσθαι, μέγιστον δὲ πάντων εἶναι προστεταγμένον ὑπὸ δικαίου νόμου· τοῦ γὰρ πᾶσαν τῶν ἄλλων πάντων ἔργων βίου ἀσχολίαν παρασκευάζοντος, τοῦ Πυθιάδος τε καὶ Ὀλυμπιάδος νίκης ὀρεγομένου, διπλασίας τε καὶ ἔτι πολλῷ πλέονος ἀσχολίας ἐστὶν γέμων ὁ περὶ τὴν τοῦ σώματος πάντως καὶ ψυχῆς εἰς ἀρετῆς ἐπιμέλειαν βίος εἰρημένος ὀρθότατα.
807d. For there ought to be no other secondary task to hinder the work of supplying the body with its proper exercise and nourishment, or the soul with learning and moral training: nay, every night and day is not sufficient for the man who is occupied therein to win from them their fruit in full and ample measure. So this being nature’s law, a program must be framed for all the freeborn men, prescribing how they shall pass their time continuously, from dawn to dawn and sunrise on each successive day.
807d. πάρεργον γὰρ οὐδὲν δεῖ τῶν ἄλλων ἔργων διακώλυμα γίγνεσθαι τῶν τῷ σώματι προσηκόντων εἰς ἀπόδοσιν πόνων καὶ τροφῆς, οὐδʼ αὖ ψυχῇ μαθημάτων τε καὶ ἐθῶν, πᾶσα δὲ νύξ τε καὶ ἡμέρα σχεδὸν οὐκ ἔστιν ἱκανὴ τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ πράττοντι τὸ τέλεόν τε καὶ ἱκανὸν αὐτῶν ἐκλαμβάνειν· οὕτω δὴ τούτων πεφυκότων, τάξιν δεῖ γίγνεσθαι πᾶσιν τοῖς ἐλευθέροις τῆς διατριβῆς περὶ τὸν χρόνον ἅπαντα, σχεδὸν ἀρξάμενον ἐξ ἕω μέχρι τῆς ἑτέρας ἀεὶ συνεχῶς ἕω τε καὶ ἡλίου ἀνατολῆς.
807e. It would be undignified for a lawgiver to mention a host of petty matters connected with the domestic arrangements—such as, in particular, the rules about that wakefulness at night which is proper for men who propose to guard a whole State adequately and continuously.
807e. πολλὰ μὲν οὖν καὶ πυκνὰ καὶ σμικρὰ λέγων ἄν τις νομοθέτης ἀσχήμων φαίνοιτο περὶ τῶν κατʼ οἰκίαν διοικήσεων, τά τε ἄλλα καὶ ὅσα νύκτωρ ἀυπνίας πέρι πρέπει τοῖς μέλλουσιν διὰ τέλους φυλάξειν πᾶσαν πόλιν ἀκριβῶς.
808. Ath. That any citizen, indeed, should spend the whole of any night in sleep, instead of setting an example to his household by being himself always the first to awaken and rise—such a practice must be counted by all a shameful one, unworthy of a free man, whether it be called a custom or a law.
808. ΑΘ.τὸ γὰρ ὅλην διατελεῖν ἡντινοῦν νύκτα εὕδοντα καὶ ὁντινοῦν τῶν πολιτῶν, καὶ μὴ φανερὸν εἶναι πᾶσι τοῖς οἰκέταις ἐγειρόμενόν τε καὶ ἐξανιστάμενον ἀεὶ πρῶτον, τοῦτο αἰσχρὸν δεῖ δεδόχθαι πᾶσι καὶ οὐκ ἐλευθέρου, εἴτʼ οὖν νόμον εἴτʼ ἐπιτήδευμα τὸ τοιοῦτον καλεῖν ἐστιν χρεών·
808a. Moreover, that the mistress of a house should be awakened by maids, instead of being herself the first to wake up all the others—this is a shameful practice; and that it is so all the servants must declare to one another—bondman and bondmaid and boy, yea, even (were it possible) every stone in the house. And, when awake by night, they must certainly transact a large share of business, both political and economical, the magistrates in the city, and the masters and mistresses in their own houses.
808a. καὶ δὴ καὶ δέσποιναν ἐν οἰκίᾳ ὑπὸ θεραπαινίδων ἐγείρεσθαί τινων καὶ μὴ πρώτην αὐτὴν ἐγείρειν τὰς ἄλλας, αἰσχρὸν λέγειν χρὴ πρὸς αὑτοὺς δοῦλόν τε καὶ δούλην καὶ παῖδα, καὶ εἴ πως ἦν οἷόν τε, ὅλην καὶ πᾶσαν τὴν οἰκίαν. ἐγειρομένους δὲ νύκτωρ δεῖ πάντας πράττειν τῶν τε πολιτικῶν μέρη πολλὰ καὶ τῶν οἰκονομικῶν, ἄρχοντας μὲν κατὰ πόλιν, δεσποίνας δὲ καὶ δεσπότας ἐν ἰδίαις οἰκίαις.
808b. For much sleep is not naturally suitable either to our bodies or souls, nor yet to employment on any such matters. For when asleep no man is worth anything, any more than if he were dead: on the contrary, every one of us who cares most greatly for life and thought keeps awake as long as possible, only reserving so much time for sleep as his health requires— and that is but little, once the habit is well formed.
808b. ὕπνος γὰρ δὴ πολὺς οὔτε τοῖς σώμασιν οὔτε ταῖς ψυχαῖς ἡμῶν οὐδʼ αὖ ταῖς πράξεσιν ταῖς περὶ ταῦτα πάντα ἁρμόττων ἐστὶν κατὰ φύσιν. καθεύδων γὰρ οὐδεὶς οὐδενὸς ἄξιος, οὐδὲν μᾶλλον τοῦ μὴ ζῶντος· ἀλλʼ ὅστις τοῦ ζῆν ἡμῶν καὶ τοῦ φρονεῖν μάλιστά ἐστι κηδεμών, ἐγρήγορε χρόνον ὡς πλεῖστον, τὸ πρὸς ὑγίειαν αὐτοῦ μόνον φυλάττων χρήσιμον, ἔστιν δὲ οὐ πολύ, καλῶς εἰς ἔθος ἰόν.
808c. And rulers that are watchful by night in cities are a terror to evil-doers, be they citizens or enemies, but objects of respect and admiration to the just and temperate; and they confer benefit alike on themselves and on the whole State. The night, if spent in this way, will—in addition to all the other benefits described—lend greater fortitude to the souls of all who reside in these States. With the return of daylight the children should go to their teachers;
808c. ἐγρηγορότες δὲ ἄρχοντες ἐν πόλεσιν νύκτωρ φοβεροὶ μὲν κακοῖς, πολεμίοις τε ἅμα καὶ πολίταις, ἀγαστοὶ δὲ καὶ τίμιοι τοῖς δικαίοις τε καὶ σώφροσιν, ὠφέλιμοι δὲ αὑτοῖς τε καὶ συμπάσῃ τῇ πόλει.νὺξ μὲν δὴ διαγομένη τοιαύτη τις πρὸς πᾶσι τοῖς εἰρημένοις ἀνδρείαν ἄν τινα προσπαρέχοιτο ταῖς ψυχαῖς ἑκάστων τῶν ἐν ταῖς πόλεσιν·
808d. for just as no sheep or other witless creature ought to exist without a herdsman, so children cannot live without a tutor, nor slaves without a master. And, of all wild creatures, the child is the most intractable; for in so far as it, above all others, possesses a fount of reason that is as yet uncurbed, it is a treacherous, sly and most insolent creature. Wherefore the child must be strapped up, as it were, with many bridles—first, when he leaves the care of nurse and mother, with tutors, to guide his childish ignorance, and after that with teachers of all sorts of subjects and lessons, treating him as becomes a freeborn child.
808d. ἡμέρας δὲ ὄρθρου τε ἐπανιόντων παῖδας μὲν πρὸς διδασκάλους που τρέπεσθαι χρεών, ἄνευ ποιμένος δὲ οὔτε πρόβατα οὔτʼ ἄλλο οὐδέν πω βιωτέον, οὐδὲ δὴ παῖδας ἄνευ τινῶν παιδαγωγῶν οὐδὲ δούλους ἄνευ δεσποτῶν. ὁ δὲ παῖς πάντων θηρίων ἐστὶ δυσμεταχειριστότατον· ὅσῳ γὰρ μάλιστα ἔχει πηγὴν τοῦ φρονεῖν μήπω κατηρτυμένην, ἐπίβουλον καὶ δριμὺ καὶ ὑβριστότατον θηρίων γίγνεται. διὸ δὴ πολλοῖς αὐτὸ οἷον χαλινοῖς τισιν δεῖ δεσμεύειν, πρῶτον μέν, τροφῶν καὶ μητέρων ὅταν ἀπαλλάττηται, παιδαγωγοῖς παιδίας καὶ νηπιότητος χάριν, ἔτι δʼ αὖ τοῖς διδάσκουσιν καὶ ὁτιοῦν καὶ μαθήμασιν ὡς ἐλεύθερον·
808e. On the other hand, he must be treated as a slave; and any free man that meets him shall punish both the child himself and his tutor or teacher, if any of them does wrong.
808e. ὡς δʼ αὖ δοῦλον, πᾶς ὁ προστυγχάνων τῶν ἐλευθέρων ἀνδρῶν κολαζέτω τόν τε παῖδα αὐτὸν καὶ τὸν παιδαγωγὸν καὶ διδάσκαλον, ἐὰν ἐξαμαρτάνῃ τίς τι τούτων.
809. Ath. And if anyone thus meets them and fails to punish them duly, he shall, in the first place, be liable to the deepest degradation; and the Law-warden who is chosen as president over the children shall keep his eye on the man who has met with the wrong-doings mentioned and has failed either to inflict the needed punishment at all, or else to inflict it rightly.
809. ΑΘ.ἂν δʼ αὖ προστυγχάνων τις μὴ κολάζῃ τῇ δίκῃ, ὀνείδει μὲν ἐνεχέσθω πρῶτον τῷ μεγίστῳ, ὁ δὲ τῶν νομοφυλάκων ἐπὶ τὴν τῶν παίδων ἀρχὴν ᾑρημένος ἐπισκοπείτω τοῦτον τὸν ἐντυγχάνοντα οἷς λέγομεν καὶ μὴ κολάζοντα δέον κολάζειν, ἢ κολάζοντα μὴ κατὰ τρόπον, βλέπων δὲ ἡμῖν ὀξὺ καὶ διαφερόντως ἐπιμελούμενος τῆς τῶν παίδων τροφῆς κατευθυνέτω τὰς φύσεις αὐτῶν, ἀεὶ τρέπων πρὸς τἀγαθὸν κατὰ νόμους.
809a. Moreover, this Law-warden shall exercise special supervision, with a keen eye, over the rearing of the children, to keep their growing natures in the straight way, by turning them always towards goodness, as the laws direct. But how is the law itself to give an adequate education to this Law-warden of ours? For, up to the present, the law has not as yet made any clear or adequate statement: it has mentioned some things, but omitted others. But in dealing with this warden it must omit nothing, but fully expound every ordinance that he may be both expositor and nurturer to the rest. Matters of choristry of tunes and dancing, and what types are to be selected, remodelled, and consecrated—all this has already been dealt with; but with regard to the kind of literature that is written but without meter we have never put the question—O excellent supervisor of children, of what sort ought this prose to be, and in what fashion are your charges to deal with it?
809a. τοῦτον δὲ αὐτὸν αὖ πῶς ἂν ἡμῖν ὁ νόμος αὐτὸς παιδεύσειεν ἱκανῶς; νῦν μὲν γὰρ δὴ εἴρηκεν οὐδέν πω σαφὲς οὐδὲ ἱκανόν, ἀλλὰ τὰ μέν, τὰ δʼ οὔ· δεῖ δὲ εἰς δύναμιν μηδὲν παραλείπειν αὐτῷ, πάντα δὲ λόγον ἀφερμηνεύειν, ἵνα οὗτος τοῖς ἄλλοις μηνυτής τε ἅμα καὶ τροφεὺς γίγνηται. τὰ μὲν οὖν δὴ χορείας πέρι μελῶν τε καὶ ὀρχήσεως ἐρρήθη, τίνα τύπον ἔχοντα ἐκλεκτέα τέ ἐστιν καὶ ἐπανορθωτέα καὶ καθιερωτέα· τὰ δὲ ἐν γράμμασι μὲν ὄντα, ἄνευ δὲ μέτρων, ποῖα καὶ τίνα μεταχειρίζεσθαι χρή σοι τρόπον, ὦ ἄριστε τῶν παίδων ἐπιμελητά, τοὺς ὑπὸ σοῦ τρεφομένους, οὐκ εἰρήκαμεν.
809c. You know from our discourse what are the military exercises they ought to learn and to practice, but the matters that have not as yet, my friend, been fully declared to you by the lawgiver are these—first, literature, next, lyre-playing; also arithmetic, of which I said that there ought to be as much as everyone needs to learn for purposes of war, house-management and civic administration; together with what it is useful for these same purposes to learn about the courses of the heavenly bodies—stars and sun and moon—in so far as every State is obliged to take them into account.
809c. καίτοι τὰ μὲν περὶ τὸν πόλεμον ἃ δεῖ μανθάνειν τε αὐτοὺς καὶ μελετᾶν ἔχεις τῷ λόγῳ, τὰ δὲ περὶ τὰ γράμματα πρῶτον, καὶ δεύτερον λύρας πέρι καὶ λογισμῶν, ὧν ἔφαμεν δεῖν ὅσα τε πρὸς πόλεμον καὶ οἰκονομίαν καὶ τὴν κατὰ πόλιν διοίκησιν χρῆναι ἑκάστους λαβεῖν, καὶ πρὸς τὰ αὐτὰ ταῦτα ἔτι τὰ χρήσιμα τῶν ἐν ταῖς περιόδοις τῶν θείων, ἄστρων τε πέρι καὶ ἡλίου καὶ σελήνης, ὅσα διοικεῖν ἀναγκαῖόν ἐστιν περὶ ταῦτα πάσῃ πόλει—τίνων δὴ πέρι λέγομεν;
809d. What I allude to is this—the arranging of days into monthly periods, and of months into a year, in each instance, so that the seasons, with their respective sacrifices and feasts, may each be assigned its due position by being held as nature dictates, and that thus they may create fresh liveliness and alertness in the State, and may pay their due honors to the gods, and may render the citizens more intelligent about these matters. These points, my friend, have not all as yet been explained to you sufficiently by the lawgiver.
809d. ἡμερῶν τάξεως εἰς μηνῶν περιόδους καὶ μηνῶν εἰς ἕκαστον τὸν ἐνιαυτόν, ἵνα ὧραι καὶ θυσίαι καὶ ἑορταὶ τὰ προσήκοντʼ ἀπολαμβάνουσαι ἑαυταῖς ἕκασται τῷ κατὰ φύσιν ἄγεσθαι, ζῶσαν τὴν πόλιν καὶ ἐγρηγορυῖαν παρεχόμεναι, θεοῖς μὲν τὰς τιμὰς ἀποδιδῶσιν, τοὺς δὲ ἀνθρώπους περὶ αὐτὰ μᾶλλον ἔμφρονας ἀπεργάζωνται—ταῦτα οὔπω σοι πάντα ἱκανῶς, ὦ φίλε, παρὰ τοῦ νομοθέτου διείρηται·
809e. Now attend carefully to what is next to be said. In the first place, you are, as we said, insufficiently instructed as yet concerning letters. The point we complain of is this—that the law has not yet told you clearly whether the man who is to be a good citizen must pursue this study with precision, or neglect it altogether; and so likewise with regard to the lyre. That he must not neglect them we now affirm.
809e. πρόσεχε δὴ τὸν νοῦν τοῖς μετὰ ταῦτα μέλλουσιν ῥηθήσεσθαι. γραμμάτων εἴπομεν ὡς οὐχ ἱκανῶς ἔχεις πέρι τὸ πρῶτον, ἐπικαλοῦντες τί τῇ λέξει; τόδε, ὡς οὔπω διείρηκέ σοι πότερον εἰς ἀκρίβειαν τοῦ μαθήματος ἰτέον τὸν μέλλοντα πολίτην ἔσεσθαι μέτριον ἢ τὸ παράπαν οὐδὲ προσοιστέον· ὡς δʼ αὕτως καὶ περὶ λύραν. προσοιστέον μέντοι νῦν φαμεν.
810. Ath. For the study of letters, about three years is a reasonable period for a child of ten years old;
810. ΑΘ. εἰς μὲν γράμματα παιδὶ δεκετεῖ σχεδὸν ἐνιαυτοὶ τρεῖς, λύρας δὲ ἅψασθαι τρία μὲν ἔτη καὶ δέκα γεγονόσιν ἄρχεσθαι μέτριος ὁ χρόνος, ἐμμεῖναι δὲ ἕτερα τρία.
810a. and for lyre-playing, he should begin at thirteen and continue at it for three years. And whether he likes or dislikes the study, neither the child nor his father shall be permitted either to cut short or to prolong the years of study contrary to the law; and anyone who disobeys shall be disqualified for the school honors which we shall mention presently. And, during these periods, what are the subjects which the children must learn and the teachers teach—this you yourself must learn first.
810a. καὶ μήτε πλείω τούτων μήτʼ ἐλάττω πατρὶ μηδʼ αὐτῷ, φιλομαθοῦντι μηδὲ μισοῦντι, περὶ ταῦτα ἐξέστω μείζω μηδὲ ἐλάττω διατριβὴν ποιεῖσθαι παράνομον· ὁ δὲ μὴ πειθόμενος ἄτιμος τῶν παιδείων ἔστω τιμῶν, ἃς ὀλίγον ὕστερον ῥητέον. μανθάνειν δὲ ἐν τούτοις τοῖς χρόνοις δὴ τί ποτε δεῖ τοὺς νέους καὶ διδάσκειν αὖ τοὺς διδασκάλους, τοῦτο αὐτὸ πρῶτον μάνθανε.
810b. They must work at letters sufficiently to be able to read and write. But superior speed or beauty of handwriting need not be required in the case of those whose progress within the appointed period is too slow. With regard to lessons in reading, there are written compositions not set to music, whether in meter or without rhythmical divisions—compositions merely uttered in prose, void of rhythm and harmony;
810b. γράμματα μὲν τοίνυν χρὴ τὸ μέχρι τοῦ γράψαι τε καὶ ἀναγνῶναι δυνατὸν εἶναι διαπονεῖν· πρὸς τάχος δὲ ἢ κάλλος ἀπηκριβῶσθαί τισιν, οἷς μὴ φύσις ἐπέσπευσεν ἐν τοῖς τεταγμένοις ἔτεσιν, χαίρειν ἐᾶν. πρὸς δὲ δὴ μαθήματα ἄλυρα ποιητῶν κείμενα ἐν γράμμασι, τοῖς μὲν μετὰ μέτρων, τοῖς δʼ ἄνευ ῥυθμῶν τμημάτων, ἃ δὴ συγγράμματα κατὰ λόγον εἰρημένα μόνον, τητώμενα ῥυθμοῦ τε καὶ ἁρμονίας, σφαλερὰ γράμμαθʼ ἡμῖν ἐστιν παρά τινων τῶν πολλῶν τοιούτων ἀνθρώπων καταλελειμμένα·
810c. and some of the many composers of this sort have bequeathed to us writings of a dangerous character. How will you deal with these, O my most excellent Law-wardens? Or what method of dealing with them will the lawgiver rightly ordain? He will be vastly perplexed, I verily believe.
810c. οἷς, ὦ πάντων βέλτιστοι νομοφύλακες, τί χρήσεσθε; ἢ τί ποθʼ ὑμῖν ὁ νομοθέτης χρῆσθαι προστάξας ὀρθῶς ἂν τάξειε; καὶ μάλα ἀπορήσειν αὐτὸν προσδοκῶ.
Clin. What does this mean, Stranger? Evidently you are addressing yourself, and are really perplexed.
ΚΛ. τί ποτε τοῦτο, ὦ ξένε, φαίνῃ πρὸς σαυτὸν ὄντως ἠπορηκὼς λέγειν;
Ath. You are right in your supposition, Clinias. As you are my partners in this investigation of laws, I am bound to explain to you both what seems easy and what hard.
ΑΘ. ὀρθῶς ὑπέλαβες, ὦ Κλεινία. πρὸς δὲ δὴ κοινωνοὺς ὑμᾶς ὄντας περὶ νόμων ἀνάγκη τό τε φαινόμενον εὔπορον καὶ τὸ μὴ φράζειν.
810d. Clin. Well, what is it about them that you are now alluding to, and what has come over you?
810d. ΚΛ. τί οὖν; τί περὶ τούτων νῦν καὶ ποῖόν τι πεπονθὼς λέγεις;
Ath. I will tell you: it is no easy matter to gainsay tens of thousands of tongues.
ΑΘ. ἐρῶ δή· στόμασι γὰρ πολλάκις μυρίοις ἐναντία λέγειν οὐδαμῶς εὔπορον.
Clin. Come now,—do you believe that the points in which our previous conclusions about laws contradicted ordinary opinion were few and trifling?
ΚΛ. τί δέ; σμικρὰ καὶ ὀλίγα δοκεῖ σοι τὰ ἔμπροσθεν ἡμῖν εἰρημένα περὶ νόμων κεῖσθαι τοῖς πολλοῖς ὑπεναντία;
Ath. Your observation is most just. I take it that you are bidding me, now that the path which is abhorrent to many is attractive to others possibly not less numerous (or if less numerous, certainly not less competent),—you are, I say, bidding me adventure myself with the latter company and proceed boldly along the path of legislation marked out in our present discourse, without flinching.
ΑΘ. καὶ μάλα ἀληθὲς τοῦτό γε λέγεις· κελεύεις γὰρ δή με, ὡς ἐμοὶ φαίνεται, τῆς αὐτῆς ὁδοῦ ἐχθοδοποῦ γεγονυίας πολλοῖς—ἴσως δʼ οὐκ ἐλάττοσιν ἑτέροις προσφιλοῦς· εἰ δὲ ἐλάττοσιν, οὔκουν χείροσί γε—μεθʼ ὧν διακελεύῃ με παρακινδυνεύοντά τε καὶ θαρροῦντα τὴν νῦν ἐκ τῶν παρόντων λόγων τετμημένην ὁδὸν τῆς νομοθεσίας πορεύεσθαι μηδὲν ἀνιέντα.
810e. Clin. Certainly.
810e. ΚΛ. τί μήν;
811. Ath. Then I will not flinch. I verily affirm that we have composers of verses innumerable—hexameters, trimeters, and every meter you could mention,—some of whom aim at the serious, others at the comic; on whose writings, as we are told by our tens of thousands of people, we ought to rear and soak the young, if we are to give them a correct education, making them, by means of recitations, lengthy listeners and large learners, who learn off whole poets by heart.
811. ΑΘ. οὐ τοίνυν ἀνίημι. λέγω μὴν ὅτι ποιηταί τε ἡμῖν εἰσίν τινες ἐπῶν ἑξαμέτρων πάμπολλοι καὶ τριμέτρων καὶ πάντων δὴ τῶν λεγομένων μέτρων, οἱ μὲν ἐπὶ σπουδήν, οἱ δʼ ἐπὶ γέλωτα ὡρμηκότες, ἐν οἷς φασι δεῖν οἱ πολλάκις μυρίοι τοὺς ὀρθῶς παιδευομένους τῶν νέων τρέφειν καὶ διακορεῖς ποιεῖν, πολυηκόους τʼ ἐν ταῖς ἀναγνώσεσιν ποιοῦντας καὶ πολυμαθεῖς, ὅλους ποιητὰς ἐκμανθάνοντας·
811a. Others there are who compile select summaries of all the poets, and piece together whole passages, telling us that a boy must commit these to memory and learn them off if we are to have him turn out good and wise as a result of a wide and varied range of instruction. Would you have me now state frankly to these poets what is wrong about their declarations and what right?
811a. οἱ δὲ ἐκ πάντων κεφάλαια ἐκλέξαντες καί τινας ὅλας ῥήσεις εἰς ταὐτὸν συναγαγόντες, ἐκμανθάνειν φασὶ δεῖν εἰς μνήμην τιθεμένους, εἰ μέλλει τις ἀγαθὸς ἡμῖν καὶ σοφὸς ἐκ πολυπειρίας καὶ πολυμαθίας γενέσθαι. τούτοις δὴ σὺ κελεύεις ἐμὲ τὰ νῦν παρρησιαζόμενον ἀποφαίνεσθαι τί τε καλῶς λέγουσι καὶ τί μή;
Clin. Of course.
ΚΛ. πῶς γὰρ οὔ;
Ath. What single statement can I make about all these people that will be adequate?
ΑΘ. τί δή ποτʼ ἂν οὖν περὶ ἁπάντων τούτων ἑνὶ λόγῳ φράζων εἴποιμʼ ἂν ἱκανόν;
811b. This, perhaps,—in which everyone will agree with me,—that every poet has uttered much that is well, and much also that is ill; and this being so, I affirm that a wide range of learning involves danger to children.
811b. οἶμαι μὲν τὸ τοιόνδε σχεδόν, ὃ καὶ πᾶς ἄν μοι συγχωρήσειεν, πολλὰ μὲν ἕκαστον τούτων εἰρηκέναι καλῶς, πολλὰ δὲ καὶ τοὐναντίον· εἰ δʼ οὕτω τοῦτʼ ἔχει, κίνδυνόν φημι εἶναι φέρουσαν τοῖς παισὶν τὴν πολυμαθίαν.
Clin. What advice then would you give the Law-warden?
ΚΛ. πῶς οὖν καὶ τί παραινοίης ἂν τῷ νομοφύλακι;
Ath. About what?
ΑΘ. τοῦ πέρι λέγεις;
Clin. About the pattern by which he should be guided in respect of the particular subjects which he permits or forbids all the children to learn.
ΚΛ. τοῦ πρὸς τί παράδειγμά ποτε ἀποβλέψας ἂν τὸ μὲν ἐῴη πάντας μανθάνειν τοὺς νέους, τὸ δʼ ἀποκωλύοι.
811c. Tell us, and without scruple.
811c. λέγε καὶ μηδὲν ἀπόκνει λέγων.
Ath. My good Clinias, I have had, it would seem, a stroke of luck.
ΑΘ. ὠγαθὲ Κλεινία, κινδυνεύω κατά γέ τινα τρόπον ηὐτυχηκέναι.
Clin. How so?
ΚΛ. τοῦ δὴ πέρι;
Ath. In the fact that I am not wholly at a loss for a pattern. For in looking back now at the discussions which we have been pursuing from dawn up to this present hour—and that, as I fancy, not without some guidance from Heaven—it appeared to me that they were framed exactly like a poem. And it was not surprising, perhaps, that there came over me a feeling of intense delight when I gazed thus on our discourses all marshalled, as it were, in close array; for of all the many discourses which I have listened to or learnt about, whether in poems or in a loose flood of speech like ours, they struck me as being not only the most adequate, but also the most suitable for the ears of the young.
ΑΘ. τοῦ μὴ παντάπασι παραδείγματος ἀπορεῖν. νῦν γὰρ ἀποβλέψας πρὸς τοὺς λόγους οὓς ἐξ ἕω μέχρι δεῦρο δὴ διεληλύθαμεν ἡμεῖς—ὡς μὲν ἐμοὶ φαινόμεθα, οὐκ ἄνευ τινὸς ἐπιπνοίας θεῶν—ἔδοξαν δʼ οὖν μοι παντάπασι ποιήσει τινὶ προσομοίως εἰρῆσθαι. καί μοι ἴσως οὐδὲν θαυμαστὸν πάθος ἐπῆλθε, λόγους οἰκείους οἷον ἁθρόους ἐπιβλέψαντι μάλα ἡσθῆναι·
811d. Nowhere, I think, could I find a better pattern than this to put before the Law-warden who is educator, that he may charge the teachers to teach the children these discourses of ours, and such as resemble and accord with these; and if it should be that in his search he should light on poems of composers, or prose-writings, or merely verbal and unwritten discourses, akin to these of ours, he must in no wise let them go, but get them written down.
811d. τῶν γὰρ δὴ πλείστων λόγων οὓς ἐν ποιήμασιν ἢ χύδην οὕτως εἰρημένους μεμάθηκα καὶ ἀκήκοα, πάντων μοι μετριώτατοί γε εἶναι κατεφάνησαν καὶ προσήκοντες τὰ μάλιστα ἀκούειν νέοις. τῷ δὴ νομοφύλακί τε καὶ παιδευτῇ παράδειγμα οὐκ ἂν ἔχοιμι, ὡς οἶμαι, τούτου βέλτιον φράζειν, ἢ ταῦτά τε διδάσκειν παρακελεύεσθαι τοῖσι διδασκάλοις τοὺς παῖδας, τά τε τούτων ἐχόμενα καὶ ὅμοια, ἂν ἄρα που περιτυγχάνῃ ποιητῶν τε ποιήματα διεξιὼν καὶ γεγραμμένα καταλογάδην ἢ καὶ ψιλῶς οὕτως ἄνευ τοῦ γεγράφθαι λεγόμενα, ἀδελφά που τούτων τῶν λόγων, μὴ μεθιέναι τρόπῳ μηδενί, γράφεσθαι δέ·
812. Ath. In the first place, he must compel the teachers themselves to learn these discourses, and to praise them, and if any of the teachers fail to approve of them, he must not employ them as colleagues; only those who agree with his praise of the discourses should he employ, and entrust to them the teaching and training of the youth.
812. ΑΘ. καὶ πρῶτον μὲν τοὺς διδασκάλους αὐτοὺς ἀναγκάζειν μανθάνειν καὶ ἐπαινεῖν, οὓς δʼ ἂν μὴ ἀρέσκῃ τῶν διδασκάλων, μὴ χρῆσθαι τούτοις συνεργοῖς, οὓς δʼ ἂν τῷ ἐπαίνῳ συμψήφους ἔχῃ, τούτοις χρώμενον, τοὺς νέους αὐτοῖς παραδιδόναι διδάσκειν τε καὶ παιδεύειν.
812a. Here and herewith let me end my homily concerning writing-masters and writings.
812a. οὗτός μοι μῦθος ἐνταῦθα καὶ οὕτω τελευτάτω, περὶ γραμματιστῶν τε εἰρημένος ἅμα καὶ γραμμάτων.
Clin. Judged by our original intention, Stranger, I certainly do not think that we have diverged from the line of argument we intended; but about the matter as a whole it is hard, no doubt, to be sure whether or not we are right.
ΚΛ. κατὰ μὲν τὴν ὑπόθεσιν, ὦ ξένε, ἔμοιγε οὐ φαινόμεθα ἐκτὸς πορεύεσθαι τῶν ὑποτεθέντων λόγων· εἰ δὲ τὸ ὅλον κατορθοῦμεν ἢ μή, χαλεπὸν ἴσως διισχυρίζεσθαι.
Ath. That, Clinias, (as we have often said) will probably become clearer of itself when we arrive at the end of our whole exposition concerning laws.
ΑΘ. τότε γάρ, ὦ Κλεινία, τοῦτό γʼ αὐτὸ ἔσται καταφανέστερον, ὡς εἰκός, ὅταν, ὃ πολλάκις εἰρήκαμεν, ἐπὶ τέλος ἀφικώμεθα πάσης τῆς διεξόδου περὶ νόμων.
812b. Clin. Very true.
812b. ΚΛ. ὀρθῶς.
Ath. After the writing-master, must we not address the lyre-master next?
ΑΘ. ἆρʼ οὖν οὐ μετὰ τὸν γραμματιστὴν ὁ κιθαριστὴς ἡμῖν προσρητέος;
Clin. Certainly.
ΚΛ. τί μήν;
Ath. When assigning to the lyre-masters their proper duties in regard to the teaching and general training in these subjects, we must, as I think, bear in mind our previous declarations.
ΑΘ. τοῖς κιθαρισταῖς μὲν τοίνυν ἡμᾶς δοκῶ τῶν ἔμπροσθεν λόγων ἀναμνησθέντας τὸ προσῆκον νεῖμαι τῆς τε διδασκαλίας ἅμα καὶ πάσης τῆς περὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα παιδεύσεως.
Clin. Declarations about what?
ΚΛ. ποίων δὴ πέρι λέγεις;
Ath. We said, I fancy, that the sixty-year-old singers of hymns to Dionysus ought to be exceptionally keen of perception regarding rhythms and harmonic compositions, in order that when dealing with musical representations of a good kind or a bad, by which the soul is emotionally affected, they may be able to pick out the reproductions of the good kind and of the bad, and having rejected the latter, may produce the other in public, and charm the souls of the children by singing them, and so challenge them all to accompany them in acquiring virtue by means of these representations.
ΑΘ. ἔφαμεν, οἶμαι, τοὺς τοῦ Διονύσου τοὺς ἑξηκοντούτας ᾠδοὺς διαφερόντως εὐαισθήτους δεῖν γεγονέναι περί τε τοὺς ῥυθμοὺς καὶ τὰς τῶν ἁρμονιῶν συστάσεις, ἵνα τὴν τῶν μελῶν μίμησιν τὴν εὖ καὶ τὴν κακῶς μεμιμημένην, ἐν τοῖς παθήμασιν ὅταν ψυχὴ γίγνηται, τά τε τῆς ἀγαθῆς ὁμοιώματα καὶ τὰ τῆς ἐναντίας ἐκλέξασθαι δυνατὸς ὤν τις, τὰ μὲν ἀποβάλλῃ, τὰ δὲ προφέρων εἰς μέσον ὑμνῇ καὶ ἐπᾴδῃ ταῖς τῶν νέων ψυχαῖς, προκαλούμενος ἑκάστους εἰς ἀρετῆς ἕπεσθαι κτῆσιν συνακολουθοῦντας διὰ τῶν μιμήσεων.
812c. Clin. Very true.
812c. ΚΛ. ἀληθέστατα λέγεις.
812d. Ath. So, to attain this object, both the lyre-master and his pupil must use the notes of the lyre, because of the distinctness of its strings, assigning to the notes of the song notes in tune with them; but as to divergence of sound and variety in the notes of the harp, when the strings sound the one tune and the composer of the melody another, or when there results a combination of low and high notes, of slow and quick time, of sharp and grave, and all sorts of rhythmical variations are adapted to the notes of the lyre,—no such complications should be employed in dealing with pupils who have to absorb quickly, within three years, the useful elements of music.
812d. ΑΘ. τούτων τοίνυν δεῖ χάριν τοῖς φθόγγοις τῆς λύρας προσχρῆσθαι, σαφηνείας ἕνεκα τῶν χορδῶν, τόν τε κιθαριστὴν καὶ τὸν παιδευόμενον, ἀποδιδόντας πρόσχορδα τὰ φθέγματα τοῖς φθέγμασι· τὴν δʼ ἑτεροφωνίαν καὶ ποικιλίαν τῆς λύρας, ἄλλα μὲν μέλη τῶν χορδῶν ἱεισῶν, ἄλλα δὲ τοῦ τὴν μελῳδίαν συνθέντος ποιητοῦ, καὶ δὴ καὶ πυκνότητα μανότητι καὶ τάχος βραδυτῆτι καὶ ὀξύτητα βαρύτητι σύμφωνον καὶ ἀντίφωνον παρεχομένους, καὶ τῶν ῥυθμῶν ὡσαύτως παντοδαπὰ ποικίλματα προσαρμόττοντας τοῖσι φθόγγοις τῆς λύρας, πάντα οὖν τὰ τοιαῦτα μὴ προσφέρειν τοῖς μέλλουσιν ἐν τρισὶν ἔτεσιν τὸ τῆς μουσικῆς χρήσιμον ἐκλήψεσθαι διὰ τάχους.
812e. For the jarring of opposites with one another impedes easy learning; and the young should above all things learn easily, since the necessary lessons imposed upon them are neither few nor small,—which lessons our discourse will indicate in time as it proceeds.
812e. τὰ γὰρ ἐναντία ἄλληλα ταράττοντα δυσμάθειαν παρέχει, δεῖ δὲ ὅτι μάλιστα εὐμαθεῖς εἶναι τοὺς νέους· τὰ γὰρ ἀναγκαῖα οὐ σμικρὰ οὐδʼ ὀλίγα αὐτοῖς ἐστι προστεταγμένα μαθήματα, δείξει δὲ αὐτὰ προϊὼν ὁ λόγος ἅμα τῷ χρόνῳ.
813. Ath. So let our educator regulate these matters in the manner stated. As regards the character of the actual tunes and words which the choir-masters ought to teach, all this we have already explained at length.
813. ΑΘ. ἀλλὰ ταῦτα μὲν οὕτω περὶ τῆς μουσικῆς ἡμῖν ὁ παιδευτὴς ἐπιμελείσθω· τὰ δὲ μελῶν αὐτῶν αὖ καὶ ῥημάτων, οἷα τοὺς χοροδιδασκάλους καὶ ἃ δεῖ διδάσκειν, καὶ ταῦτα ἡμῖν ἐν τοῖς πρόσθεν διείρηται πάντα, ἃ δὴ καθιερωθέντα ἔφαμεν δεῖν, ταῖς ἑορταῖς ἕκαστα ἁρμόττοντα, ἡδονὴν εὐτυχῆ ταῖς πόλεσιν παραδιδόντα ὠφελεῖν.
813a. We stated that in each case they should be adapted to a suitable festival and dedicated, and thus prove a benefit to the States, by furnishing them with felicitous enjoyment.Clin. This, too, you have explained truly.Ath. Yes, most truly. These matters also let the man who is appointed our Director of Music take over and supervise, with the help of kindly fortune; and let us supplement our former statements concerning dancing and bodily gymnastics in general.
813a. ΚΛ. ἀληθῆ καὶ ταῦτα διείρηκας.ΑΘ. ἀληθέστατα τοίνυν. καὶ ταῦθʼ ἡμῖν παραλαβὼν ὁ περὶ τὴν μοῦσαν ἄρχων αἱρεθεὶς ἐπιμελείσθω μετὰ τύχης εὐμενοῦς, ἡμεῖς δὲ ὀρχήσεώς τε πέρι καὶ ὅλης τῆς περὶ τὸ σῶμα γυμναστικῆς πρὸς τοῖς ἔμπροσθεν εἰρημένοις ἀποδῶμεν·
813b. Just as, in the case of music, we have supplied the regulations about tuition that were missing, so also let us now do in the case of gymnastics. Shall we not say that both girls and boys must learn both dancing and gymnastics?
813b. καθάπερ μουσικῆς τὸ διδασκαλικὸν ὑπόλοιπον ὂν ἀπέδομεν, ὡσαύτως ποιῶμεν καὶ γυμναστικῆς. τοὺς γὰρ παῖδάς τε καὶ τὰς παῖδας ὀρχεῖσθαι δὴ δεῖ καὶ γυμνάζεσθαι μανθάνειν· ἦ γάρ;
Ath. Then for their practices it would be most proper that boys should have dancing-masters, and girls mistresses.
ΑΘ. τοῖς μὲν τοίνυν παισὶν ὀρχησταί, ταῖς δὲ ὀρχηστρίδες ἂν εἶεν πρὸς τὸ διαπονεῖν οὐκ ἀνεπιτηδειότερον.
Clin. I grant it.
ΚΛ. ἔστω δὴ ταύτῃ.
Ath. Let us once more summon the man who will have most of these duties to perform, the Director of the Children,—who, in supervising both music and gymnastic, will have but little time to spare.
ΑΘ. πάλιν δὴ τὸν τὰ πλεῖστα ἕξοντα πράγματα καλῶμεν, τὸν τῶν παίδων ἐπιμελητήν, ὃς τῶν τε περὶ μουσικὴν τῶν τε περὶ γυμναστικὴν ἐπιμελούμενος οὐ πολλὴν ἕξει σχολήν.
813c. Clin. How will he be able, at his age, to supervise so many affairs?
813c. ΚΛ. πῶς οὖν δυνατὸς ἔσται πρεσβύτερος ὢν τοσούτων ἐπιμελεῖσθαι;
Ath. Quite easily. For the law has granted him, and will continue to grant him, such men or women as he wishes to take to assist him in this task of supervision: he will know himself the right persons to choose, and he will be anxious to make no blunder in these matters, recognizing the greatness of his office and wisely holding it in high respect, and holding also the rational conviction that, when the young have been, and are being, well brought up, all goes “swimmingly,” but otherwise—the consequences are such as it is wrong to speak of, nor will we mention them, in dealing with a new State, out of consideration for the over-superstitious.
ΑΘ. ῥᾳδίως, ὦ φίλε. ὁ νόμος γὰρ αὐτῷ δέδωκεν καὶ δώσει προσλαμβάνειν εἰς ταύτην τὴν ἐπιμέλειαν τῶν πολιτῶν ἀνδρῶν καὶ γυναικῶν οὓς ἂν ἐθέλῃ, γνώσεται δὲ οὓς δεῖ, καὶ βουλήσεται μὴ πλημμελεῖν εἰς ταῦτα, αἰδούμενος ἐμφρόνως καὶ γιγνώσκων τῆς ἀρχῆς τὸ μέγεθος, λογισμῷ τε συνὼν ὡς εὖ μὲν τραφέντων καὶ τρεφομένων τῶν νέων πάντα ἡμῖν κατʼ ὀρθὸν πλεῖ, μὴ δέ—οὔτʼ εἰπεῖν ἄξιον οὔθʼ ἡμεῖς λέγομεν ἐπὶ καινῇ πόλει τοὺς σφόδρα φιλομαντευτὰς σεβόμενοι.
813d. Concerning these matters also, which relate to dancing and gymnastic movements, we have already spoken at length. We are establishing gymnasia and all physical exercises connected with military training,—the use of the bow and all kinds of missiles, light skirmishing and heavy-armed fighting of every description, tactical evolutions, company-marching, camp-formations, and all the details of cavalry training.
813d. πολλὰ μὲν οὖν ἡμῖν καὶ περὶ τούτων εἴρηται, τῶν περὶ τὰς ὀρχήσεις καὶ περὶ πᾶσαν τὴν τῶν γυμνασίων κίνησιν· γυμνάσια γὰρ τίθεμεν καὶ τὰ περὶ τὸν πόλεμον ἅπαντα τοῖς σώμασι διαπονήματα τοξικῆς τε καὶ πάσης ῥίψεως καὶ πελταστικῆς καὶ πάσης ὁπλομαχίας καὶ διεξόδων τακτικῶν καὶ ἁπάσης πορείας στρατοπέδων καὶ στρατοπεδεύσεων καὶ ὅσα εἰς ἱππικὴν μαθήματα συντείνει.
814. Ath. In all these subjects there should be public instructors, paid by the State; and their pupils should be not only the boys and men in the State, but also the girls and women who understand all these matters—being practiced in all military drill and fighting while still girls and, when grown to womanhood, taking part in evolutions and rank-forming and the piling and shouldering of arms,— and that, if for no other reason, at least for this reason, that, if ever the guards of the children and of the rest of the city should be obliged to leave the city and march out in full force, these women should be able at least to take their place; while if, on the other hand—and this is quite a possible contingency—an invading army of foreigners, fierce and strong, should force a battle round the city itself,
814. ΑΘ. πάντων γὰρ τούτων διδασκάλους τε εἶναι δεῖ κοινούς, ἀρνυμένους μισθὸν παρὰ τῆς πόλεως, καὶ τούτων μαθητὰς τοὺς ἐν τῇ πόλει παῖδάς τε καὶ ἄνδρας, καὶ κόρας καὶ γυναῖκας πάντων τούτων ἐπιστήμονας, κόρας μὲν οὔσας ἔτι πᾶσαν τὴν ἐν ὅπλοις ὄρχησιν καὶ μάχην μεμελετηκυίας, γυναῖκας δέ, διεξόδων καὶ τάξεων καὶ θέσεως καὶ ἀναιρέσεως ὅπλων ἡμμένας, εἰ μηδενὸς ἕνεκα, ἀλλʼ εἴ ποτε δεήσειε πανδημεὶ πάσῃ τῇ δυνάμει καταλείποντας τὴν πόλιν ἔξω στρατεύεσθαι, τοὺς φυλάξοντας παῖδάς τε καὶ τὴν ἄλλην πόλιν ἱκανοὺς εἶναι τό γε τοσοῦτον, ἢ καὶ τοὐναντίον, ὧν οὐδὲν ἀπώμοτον, ἔξωθεν πολεμίους εἰσπεσόντας ῥώμῃ τινὶ μεγάλῃ καὶ βίᾳ, βαρβάρους εἴτε Ἕλληνας, ἀνάγκην παρασχεῖν περὶ αὐτῆς τῆς πόλεως τὴν διαμάχην γίγνεσθαι, πολλή που κακία
814b. then it would be a sore disgrace to the State if its women were so ill brought up as not even to be willing to do as do the mother-birds, which fight the strongest beasts in defence of their broods, but, instead of facing all risks, even death itself, to run straight to the temples and crowd all the shrines and holy places, and drown mankind in the disgrace of being the most craven of living creatures.
814b. πολιτείας οὕτως αἰσχρῶς τὰς γυναῖκας εἶναι τεθραμμένας, ὡς μηδʼ ὥσπερ ὄρνιθας περὶ τέκνων μαχομένας πρὸς ὁτιοῦν τῶν ἰσχυροτάτων θηρίων ἐθέλειν ἀποθνῄσκειν τε καὶ πάντας κινδύνους κινδυνεύειν, ἀλλʼ εὐθὺς πρὸς ἱερὰ φερομένας, πάντας βωμούς τε καὶ ναοὺς ἐμπιμπλάναι, καὶ δόξαν τοῦ τῶν ἀνθρώπων γένους καταχεῖν ὡς πάντων δειλότατον φύσει θηρίων ἐστίν.
Clin. By Heaven, Stranger, if ever this took place in a city, it would be a most unseemly thing, apart from the mischief of it.
ΚΛ. οὐ μὰ τὸν Δία, ὦ ξένε, οὐδαμῶς εὔσχημον γίγνοιτʼ ἄν, τοῦ κακοῦ χωρίς, τοῦτο ἐν πόλει ὅπου γίγνοιτο.
814c. Ath. Shall we, then, lay down this law,—that up to the point stated women must not neglect military training, but all citizens, men and women alike, must pay attention to it?
814c. ΑΘ. οὐκοῦν τιθῶμεν τὸν νόμον τοῦτον, μέχρι γε τοσούτου μὴ ἀμελεῖσθαι τὰ περὶ τὸν πόλεμον γυναιξὶν δεῖν, ἐπιμελεῖσθαι δὲ πάντας τοὺς πολίτας καὶ τὰς πολίτιδας;
Clin. I, for one, agree.
ΚΛ. ἐγὼ γοῦν συγχωρῶ.
Ath. As regards wrestling, some points have been explained; but we have not explained what is, in my opinion, the most important point, nor is it easy to express it in words without the help of a practical illustration.
ΑΘ. πάλης τοίνυν τὰ μὲν εἴπομεν, ὃ δʼ ἐστὶ μέγιστον, ὡς ἐγὼ φαίην ἄν, οὐκ εἰρήκαμεν, οὐδʼ ἔστι ῥᾴδιον ἄνευ τοῦ τῷ σώματι δεικνύντα ἅμα καὶ τῷ λόγῳ φράζειν. τοῦτʼ οὖν τότε κρινοῦμεν, ὅταν ἔργῳ λόγος ἀκολουθήσας μηνύσῃ τι σαφὲς τῶν τε ἄλλων ὧν εἴρηκεν πέρι, καὶ ὅτι τῇ πολεμικῇ μάχῃ πασῶν κινήσεων ὄντως ἐστὶ συγγενὴς πολὺ μάλισθʼ ἡμῖν ἡ τοιαύτη πάλη, καὶ δὴ καὶ ὅτι δεῖ ταύτην ἐκείνης χάριν ἐπιτηδεύειν, ἀλλʼ οὐκ ἐκείνην ταύτης ἕνεκα μανθάνειν.
814d. This point, then, we shall decide about when word accompanied by deed can clearly demonstrate this fact, among the others mentioned,—that wrestling of this kind is of all motions by far the most nearly allied to military fighting; and also that it is not the latter that should be learned for the sake of the former, but, on the contrary, it is the former that should be practiced for the sake of the latter.Clin. There, at any rate, you are right.Ath. For the present let this suffice as an account of the functions of the wrestling-school. Motion of the whole body, other than wrestling, has for its main division what may be rightly termed dancing; and we ought to consider it as consisting of two kinds,—the one representing the solemn movement of beautiful bodies, the other the ignoble movement of ugly bodies; and of these again there are two subdivisions.
814d. ΚΛ. καλῶς τοῦτό γε λέγεις.ΑΘ. νῦν δὴ τῆς μὲν περὶ παλαίστραν δυνάμεως τὸ μέχρι δεῦρʼ ἡμῖν εἰρήσθω· περὶ δὲ τῆς ἄλλης κινήσεως παντὸς τοῦ σώματος, ἧς τὸ πλεῖστον μέρος ὄρχησίν τινά τις προσαγορεύων ὀρθῶς ἂν φθέγγοιτο, δύο μὲν αὐτῆς εἴδη χρὴ νομίζειν εἶναι, τὴν μὲν τῶν καλλιόνων σωμάτων ἐπὶ τὸ σεμνὸν μιμουμένην, τὴν δὲ τῶν αἰσχιόνων ἐπὶ τὸ φαῦλον, καὶ πάλιν τοῦ φαύλου τε δύο καὶ τοῦ σπουδαίου δύο ἕτερα.
815. Ath. Of the noble kind there is, on the one hand, the motion of fighting, and that of fair bodies and brave souls engaged in violent effort; and, on the other hand, there is the motion of a temperate soul living in a state of prosperity and moderate pleasures; and this latter kind of dancing one will call, in accordance with its nature, “pacific.” The warlike division, being distinct from the pacific, one may rightly term “pyrrhiche”; it represents modes of eluding all kinds of blows and shots by swervings and duckings and side-leaps upward or crouching; and also the opposite kinds of motion, which lead to active postures of offence, when it strives to represent the movements involved in shooting with bows or darts, and blows of every description. In all these cases the action and the tension of the sinews are correct when there is a representation of fair bodies and souls in which most of the limbs of the body are extended straight: this kind of representation is right, but the opposite kind we pronounce to be wrong.
815. ΑΘ. τοῦ δὴ σπουδαίου τὴν μὲν κατὰ πόλεμον καὶ ἐν βιαίοις ἐμπλακέντων πόνοις σωμάτων μὲν καλῶν, ψυχῆς δʼ ἀνδρικῆς, τὴν δʼ ἐν εὐπραγίαις τε οὔσης ψυχῆς σώφρονος ἐν ἡδοναῖς τε ἐμμέτροις· εἰρηνικὴν ἄν τις λέγων κατὰ φύσιν τὴν τοιαύτην ὄρχησιν λέγοι. τὴν πολεμικὴν δὴ τούτων, ἄλλην οὖσαν τῆς εἰρηνικῆς, πυρρίχην ἄν τις ὀρθῶς προσαγορεύοι, τάς τε εὐλαβείας πασῶν πληγῶν καὶ βολῶν ἐκνεύσεσι καὶ ὑπείξει πάσῃ καὶ ἐκπηδήσεσιν ἐν ὕψει καὶ σὺν ταπεινώσει μιμουμένην, καὶ τὰς ταύταις ἐναντίας, τὰς ἐπὶ τὰ δραστικὰ φερομένας αὖ σχήματα, ἔν τε ταῖς τῶν τόξων βολαῖς καὶ ἀκοντίων καὶ πασῶν πληγῶν μιμήματα ἐπιχειρούσας μιμεῖσθαι· τό τε ὀρθὸν ἐν τούτοις καὶ τὸ εὔτονον, τῶν ἀγαθῶν σωμάτων καὶ ψυχῶν ὁπόταν γίγνηται μίμημα, εὐθυφερὲς ὡς τὸ πολὺ τῶν τοῦ σώματος μελῶν γιγνόμενον, ὀρθὸν μὲν τὸ τοιοῦτον, τὸ δὲ τούτοις τοὐναντίον οὐκ ὀρθὸν ἀποδεχόμενον.
815b. In pacific dancing, the point we must consider in every case is whether the performer in his dances keeps always rightly, or improperly, to the noble kind of dancing, in the way that befits law-abiding men. So, in the first place, we must draw a line between questionable dancing and dancing that is above question.
815b. τὴν δὲ εἰρηνικὴν ὄρχησιν τῇδʼ αὖ θεωρητέον ἑκάστων, εἴτε ὀρθῶς εἴτε μὴ κατὰ φύσιν τις τῆς καλῆς ὀρχήσεως ἀντιλαμβανόμενος ἐν χορείαις πρεπόντως εὐνόμων ἀνδρῶν διατελεῖ. τὴν τοίνυν ἀμφισβητουμένην ὄρχησιν δεῖ πρῶτον χωρὶς τῆς ἀναμφισβητήτου διατεμεῖν.
815c. All the dancing that is of a Bacchic kind and cultivated by those who indulge in drunken imitations of Pans, Sileni and Satyrs (as they call them), when performing certain rites of expiation and initiation,—all this class of dancing cannot easily be defined either as pacific or as warlike, or as of any one distinct kind. The most correct way of defining it seems to me to be this— to separate it off both from pacific and from warlike dancing, and to pronounce that this kind of dancing is unfitted for our citizens: and having thus disposed of it and dismissed it, we will now return to the warlike and pacific kinds which do beyond question belong to us.
815c. τίς οὖν αὕτη, καὶ πῇ δεῖ χωρὶς τέμνειν ἑκατέραν; ὅση μὲν βακχεία τʼ ἐστὶν καὶ τῶν ταύταις ἑπομένων, ἃς Νύμφας τε καὶ Πᾶνας καὶ Σειληνοὺς καὶ Σατύρους ἐπονομάζοντες, ὥς φασιν, μιμοῦνται κατῳνωμένους, περὶ καθαρμούς τε καὶ τελετάς τινας ἀποτελούντων, σύμπαν τοῦτο τῆς ὀρχήσεως τὸ γένος οὔθʼ ὡς εἰρηνικὸν οὔθʼ ὡς πολεμικὸν οὔθʼ ὅτι ποτὲ βούλεται ῥᾴδιον ἀφορίσασθαι· διορίσασθαι μήν μοι ταύτῃ δοκεῖ σχεδὸν ὀρθότατον αὐτὸ εἶναι, χωρὶς μὲν πολεμικοῦ, χωρὶς δὲ εἰρηνικοῦ θέντας, εἰπεῖν ὡς οὐκ ἔστι πολιτικὸν τοῦτο τῆς ὀρχήσεως τὸ γένος, ἐνταῦθα δὲ κείμενον ἐάσαντας κεῖσθαι, νῦν ἐπὶ τὸ πολεμικὸν ἅμα καὶ εἰρηνικὸν ὡς ἀναμφισβητήτως ἡμέτερον ὂν ἐπανιέναι.
815d. That of the unwarlike Muse, in which men pay honor to the gods and the children of the gods by dances, will consist, broadly speaking, of all dancing performed under a sense of prosperity: of this we may make two subdivisions— the one being of a more joyful description, and proper to men who have escaped out of toils and perils into a state of bliss,—and the other connected rather with the preservation and increase of pre-existent blessings, and exhibiting, accordingly, joyousness of a less ardent kind.
815d. τὸ δὲ τῆς ἀπολέμου μούσης, ἐν ὀρχήσεσιν δὲ τούς τε θεοὺς καὶ τοὺς τῶν θεῶν παῖδας τιμώντων, ἓν μὲν σύμπαν γίγνοιτʼ ἂν γένος ἐν δόξῃ τοῦ πράττειν εὖ γιγνόμενον, τοῦτο δὲ διχῇ διαιροῖμεν ἄν, τὸ μὲν ἐκ πόνων τινῶν αὐτοῦ καὶ κινδύνων διαπεφευγότων εἰς ἀγαθά, μείζους ἡδονὰς ἔχον, τὸ δὲ τῶν ἔμπροσθεν ἀγαθῶν σωτηρίας οὔσης καὶ ἐπαύξης, πρᾳοτέρας τὰς ἡδονὰς κεκτημένον ἐκείνων.
816. Ath. Under these conditions every man moves his body more violently when his joys are greater, less violently when they are smaller; also, he moves it less violently when he is more sedate and better trained in courage, but when he is cowardly and untrained in temperance, he indulges in greater and more violent changes of motion; and in general, no one who is using his voice, whether in song or in speech, is able to keep his body wholly at rest.
816. ΑΘ.ἐν δὲ δὴ τοῖς τοιούτοις που πᾶς ἄνθρωπος τὰς κινήσεις τοῦ σώματος μειζόνων μὲν τῶν ἡδονῶν οὐσῶν μείζους, ἐλαττόνων δὲ ἐλάττους κινεῖται, καὶ κοσμιώτερος μὲν ὢν πρός τε ἀνδρείαν μᾶλλον γεγυμνασμένος ἐλάττους αὖ, δειλὸς δὲ καὶ ἀγύμναστος γεγονὼς πρὸς τὸ σωφρονεῖν μείζους καὶ σφοδροτέρας παρέχεται μεταβολὰς τῆς κινήσεως·
816a. Hence, when the representation of things spoken by means of gestures arose, it produced the whole art of dancing. In all these instances, one man of us moves in tune with his theme, another out of tune.
816a. ὅλως δὲ φθεγγόμενος, εἴτʼ ἐν ᾠδαῖς εἴτʼ ἐν λόγοις, ἡσυχίαν οὐ πάνυ δυνατὸς τῷ σώματι παρέχεσθαι πᾶς. διὸ μίμησις τῶν λεγομένων σχήμασι γενομένη τὴν ὀρχηστικὴν ἐξηργάσατο τέχνην σύμπασαν. ὁ μὲν οὖν ἐμμελῶς ἡμῶν, ὁ δὲ πλημμελῶς ἐν τούτοις πᾶσι κινεῖται.
816b. Many of the names bestowed in ancient times are deserving of notice and of praise for their excellence and descriptiveness: one such is the name given to the dances of men who are in a prosperous state and indulge in pleasures of a moderate kind: how true and how musical was the name so rationally bestowed on those dances by the man (whoever he was) who first called them all “Emmeleiai,” and established two species of fair dances—the warlike, termed “pyrrhiche,” and the pacific, termed “emmeleia”—bestowing on each its appropriate and harmonious name.
816b. πολλὰ μὲν δὴ τοίνυν ἄλλα ἡμῖν τῶν παλαιῶν ὀνομάτων ὡς εὖ καὶ κατὰ φύσιν κείμενα δεῖ διανοούμενον ἐπαινεῖν, τούτων δὲ ἓν καὶ τὸ περὶ τὰς ὀρχήσεις τὰς τῶν εὖ πραττόντων, ὄντων δὲ μετρίων αὐτῶν πρὸς τὰς ἡδονάς, ὡς ὀρθῶς ἅμα καὶ μουσικῶς ὠνόμασεν ὅστις ποτʼ ἦν, καὶ κατὰ λόγον αὐταῖς θέμενος ὄνομα συμπάσαις ἐμμελείας ἐπωνόμασε, καὶ δύο δὴ τῶν ὀρχήσεων τῶν καλῶν εἴδη κατεστήσατο, τὸ μὲν πολεμικὸν πυρρίχην, τὸ δὲ εἰρηνικὸν ἐμμέλειαν, ἑκατέρῳ τὸ πρέπον τε καὶ ἁρμόττον ἐπιθεὶς ὄνομα.
816c. These dances the lawgiver should describe in outline, and the Law-warden should search them out and, having investigated them, he should combine the dancing with the rest of the music, and assign what is proper of it to each of the sacrificial feasts, distributing it over all the feasts; and when he has thus consecrated all these things in due order, he should thenceforth make no change in all that appertains to either dancing or singing, but this one and the same city and body of citizens should continue in one and the same way, enjoying the same pleasures and living alike in all ways possible, and so pass their lives happily and well.
816c. ἃ δὴ δεῖ τὸν μὲν νομοθέτην ἐξηγεῖσθαι τύποις, τὸν δὲ νομοφύλακα ζητεῖν τε, καὶ ἀνερευνησάμενον, μετὰ τῆς ἄλλης μουσικῆς τὴν ὄρχησιν συνθέντα καὶ νείμαντα ἐπὶ πάσας ἑορτὰς τῶν θυσιῶν ἑκάστῃ τὸ πρόσφορον, οὕτω καθιερώσαντα αὐτὰ πάντα ἐν τάξει, τοῦ λοιποῦ μὴ κινεῖν μηδὲν μήτε ὀρχήσεως ἐχόμενον μήτε ᾠδῆς, ἐν ταῖς δʼ αὐταῖς ἡδοναῖς ὡσαύτως τὴν αὐτὴν πόλιν καὶ πολίτας διάγοντας, ὁμοίους εἰς δύναμιν ὄντας, ζῆν εὖ τε καὶ εὐδαιμόνως.τὰ μὲν οὖν τῶν καλῶν σωμάτων καὶ γενναίων ψυχῶν εἰς τὰς χορείας, οἵας εἴρηται δεῖν αὐτὰς εἶναι, διαπεπέρανται, τὰ δὲ τῶν αἰσχρῶν σωμάτων καὶ διανοημάτων καὶ τῶν ἐπὶ τὰ τοῦ γέλωτος κωμῳδήματα τετραμμένων, κατὰ λέξιν τε καὶ ᾠδὴν καὶ κατὰ ὄρχησιν καὶ κατὰ τὰ τούτων πάντων μιμήματα κεκωμῳδημένα, ἀνάγκη μὲν θεάσασθαι καὶ γνωρίζειν·
816d. What concerns the actions of fair and noble souls in the matter of that kind of choristry which we have approved as right has now been fully discussed. The actions of ugly bodies and ugly ideas and of the men engaged in ludicrous comic-acting, in regard to both speech and dance, and the representations given by all these comedians—all this subject we must necessarily consider and estimate. For it is impossible to learn the serious without the comic, or any one of a pair of contraries without the other, if one is to he a wise man; but to put both into practice is equally impossible, if one is to share in even a small measure of virtue; in fact, it is precisely for this reason that one should learn them,—in order to avoid ever doing or saying anything ludicrous, through ignorance, when one ought not; we will impose such mimicry on slaves and foreign hirelings, and no serious attention shall ever be paid to it, nor shall any free man or free woman be seen learning it, and there must always be some novel feature in their mimic shows.
816d. ἄνευ γὰρ γελοίων τὰ σπουδαῖα καὶ πάντων τῶν ἐναντίων τὰ ἐναντία μαθεῖν μὲν οὐ δυνατόν, εἰ μέλλει τις φρόνιμος ἔσεσθαι, ποιεῖν δὲ οὐκ αὖ δυνατὸν ἀμφότερα, εἴ τις αὖ μέλλει καὶ σμικρὸν ἀρετῆς μεθέξειν, ἀλλὰ αὐτῶν ἕνεκα τούτων καὶ μανθάνειν αὐτὰ δεῖ, τοῦ μή ποτε διʼ ἄγνοιαν δρᾶν ἢ λέγειν ὅσα γελοῖα, μηδὲν δέον, δούλοις δὲ τὰ τοιαῦτα καὶ ξένοις ἐμμίσθοις προστάττειν μιμεῖσθαι, σπουδὴν δὲ περὶ αὐτὰ εἶναι μηδέποτε μηδʼ ἡντινοῦν, μηδέ τινα μανθάνοντα αὐτὰ γίγνεσθαι φανερὸν τῶν ἐλευθέρων, μήτε γυναῖκα μήτε ἄνδρα, καινὸν δὲ ἀεί τι περὶ αὐτὰ φαίνεσθαι τῶν μιμημάτων.